Heist Of The Mrccfl
12-23-2004, 05:46 PM
#31
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Richardson Texas
Posts: 4,326
Originally Posted by mazdadrifter' date='Dec 23 2004, 05:41 PM
12-23-2004, 06:20 PM
#32
Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stuart, FL
Posts: 24,416
Well since I know none of you directly involved I've got little information to go on.
My first questions would be does the club have a charter? Were you given anything upon registration that stated how club funds would be used? Is there a provision for elections?
I have been involved in various clubs over the years, been president, vp and treasurer. I have seen the exact scenario play out several times. There's a couple ways it ALWAYS goes.
1) Club members get pissed at head guy look into the club charter and decided to hold an election, oust the current leadership and move on without them.
2) Club members read the charter, realize there is nothing they can do and that the club was designed and put together in a manner that gives them little or no say in who runs, get pissed, leave start their own club, take a few members that agree with them away, leave the ones that don't behind.
3) Everyone gets pissed, throws up their hands, cusses and swears to the point where no one wants anything to do with anyone and the club folds.
Scenario two is usually the better for all involved. The members of the old club that are happy with the way it runs stay behind and the new ones move onto to their club.
There's really never any way to please everyone. You oust the current leadership and the ones that liked him hate you and either stick around and make every effort to push you out the door and leave all together. Voting a new person in charge seems like a great idea, but there's never a way to please everyone, as soon as you start to try whatever you do please a few pisses off the rest. You might call it a dictatorship, but I've never seen a club survive any other way, you start trying to please everyone and meetings end up looking like a bunch of ladies arguing over what color ribbon to get for the summer ball... things go no where.
As far as the money, usually you have no say over what it's spent on in a club. The people in charge make the decisions, if that pisses you off then you should have figured out where the money was going and what safety's were in order so that it didn't get spent on something you don't want it to be spent on.
That's my two cents for whatever they are worth. Decided what you want to do and get it done.
My first questions would be does the club have a charter? Were you given anything upon registration that stated how club funds would be used? Is there a provision for elections?
I have been involved in various clubs over the years, been president, vp and treasurer. I have seen the exact scenario play out several times. There's a couple ways it ALWAYS goes.
1) Club members get pissed at head guy look into the club charter and decided to hold an election, oust the current leadership and move on without them.
2) Club members read the charter, realize there is nothing they can do and that the club was designed and put together in a manner that gives them little or no say in who runs, get pissed, leave start their own club, take a few members that agree with them away, leave the ones that don't behind.
3) Everyone gets pissed, throws up their hands, cusses and swears to the point where no one wants anything to do with anyone and the club folds.
Scenario two is usually the better for all involved. The members of the old club that are happy with the way it runs stay behind and the new ones move onto to their club.
There's really never any way to please everyone. You oust the current leadership and the ones that liked him hate you and either stick around and make every effort to push you out the door and leave all together. Voting a new person in charge seems like a great idea, but there's never a way to please everyone, as soon as you start to try whatever you do please a few pisses off the rest. You might call it a dictatorship, but I've never seen a club survive any other way, you start trying to please everyone and meetings end up looking like a bunch of ladies arguing over what color ribbon to get for the summer ball... things go no where.
As far as the money, usually you have no say over what it's spent on in a club. The people in charge make the decisions, if that pisses you off then you should have figured out where the money was going and what safety's were in order so that it didn't get spent on something you don't want it to be spent on.
That's my two cents for whatever they are worth. Decided what you want to do and get it done.
12-23-2004, 06:58 PM
#33
Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 37
Originally Posted by phinsup' date='Dec 23 2004, 04:20 PM
Well since I know none of you directly involved I've got little information to go on.
My first questions would be does the club have a charter? Were you given anything upon registration that stated how club funds would be used? Is there a provision for elections?
My first questions would be does the club have a charter? Were you given anything upon registration that stated how club funds would be used? Is there a provision for elections?
Do you really want the details?
John P.
12-23-2004, 07:27 PM
#34
Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stuart, FL
Posts: 24,416
Originally Posted by jdp3253' date='Dec 23 2004, 07:57 PM
i've gotten the jist more or less from Jim, i dunno what side of the story it is.
Doesn't this topic sum it up more or less?
12-23-2004, 10:20 PM
#35
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Jensen Beach, FL / Sylva, NC
Posts: 2,934
Originally Posted by jdp3253' date='Dec 23 2004, 07:57 PM
I honestly think the details are irrelavent at this point. What needs to be decided is if there is going to be a future with the MRCCFL.
I have discussed all this drama with Phins at great lengths and he already painted the picture described above for me. I am glad to see he took the time to comment here.
What some of you big players in the club need to decide is wether or not you can really walk away and not be involved in a club anymore.
I myself never liked clubs too much and this drama is exactly why. I was VERY VERY appreciative that Ian was able to negotiate a Rotary Owners appreciation day for the Mazda Rev It Up 2 years ago. The prompted me to get more involved in the club (it being my 1st ever event) and meeting a few of you there. John Fitz for one.
Then I met Damian and Mazdadrifter is right the guy knows how to promote a event like no other. He is an asset to MRCCFL and will be missed sorely.
I like Ian and have met him on a couple of occasions. I am sad to see MRCCFL has deteriorated to the point that it looks like it will break up.
I have read all you have typed and see where you are frustrated and from your side of the story it looks like you have a legit gripe.
Like I said before I am very NOT interested in being an officer of a club, but, am willing to help out in any way possible to better the Rotary community in Florida
But, the big question here is. Where do you go from here?? Another Club cetered around Damian, Jerry, Ron and Ken?? This is something you guys need to decide..
12-23-2004, 11:29 PM
#36
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Ft Lauderdale, FL
Posts: 408
Well since I know none of you directly involved I've got little information to go on.
My first questions would be does the club have a charter? Were you given anything upon registration that stated how club funds would be used? Is there a provision for elections?
I have been involved in various clubs over the years, been president, vp and treasurer. I have seen the exact scenario play out several times. There's a couple ways it ALWAYS goes.
1) Club members get pissed at head guy look into the club charter and decided to hold an election, oust the current leadership and move on without them.
Actually, there never has been an election before, this one (if it happens) will be the 1st.
2) Club members read the charter, realize there is nothing they can do and that the club was designed and put together in a manner that gives them little or no say in who runs, get pissed, leave start their own club, take a few members that agree with them away, leave the ones that don't behind.
In speaking for myself, I know Im not about to start any new club or join any others.
3) Everyone gets pissed, throws up their hands, cusses and swears to the point where no one wants anything to do with anyone and the club folds.
It seems this is the point where some of us are right now, but I still think/hope its fixable.
Scenario two is usually the better for all involved. The members of the old club that are happy with the way it runs stay behind and the new ones move onto to their club.
There's really never any way to please everyone. You oust the current leadership and the ones that liked him hate you and either stick around and make every effort to push you out the door and leave all together. Voting a new person in charge seems like a great idea, but there's never a way to please everyone, as soon as you start to try whatever you do please a few pisses off the rest. You might call it a dictatorship, but I've never seen a club survive any other way, you start trying to please everyone and meetings end up looking like a bunch of ladies arguing over what color ribbon to get for the summer ball... things go no where.
I understand about not pleasing everyone, that will always be the case. However, the last meeting that was held by the officers, I think went very well. There was topics discussed and the end result came about via a vote. So in a sense we have proven it can work.
As far as the money, usually you have no say over what it's spent on in a club. The people in charge make the decisions, if that pisses you off then you should have figured out where the money was going and what safety's were in order so that it didn't get spent on something you don't want it to be spent on.
Thats just it, the money that was collected never got spent. ALL club operations and events were being done at peoples own expense. Then upon the return of Ian, he basically accuses people of shady tactics inregards to the money.
Thanks for your insight and comments Phins, but as stated before there is quite a bit that went on people are not aware of. So thats where a lot of the confusion and frustrations are coming from.
My first questions would be does the club have a charter? Were you given anything upon registration that stated how club funds would be used? Is there a provision for elections?
I have been involved in various clubs over the years, been president, vp and treasurer. I have seen the exact scenario play out several times. There's a couple ways it ALWAYS goes.
1) Club members get pissed at head guy look into the club charter and decided to hold an election, oust the current leadership and move on without them.
Actually, there never has been an election before, this one (if it happens) will be the 1st.
2) Club members read the charter, realize there is nothing they can do and that the club was designed and put together in a manner that gives them little or no say in who runs, get pissed, leave start their own club, take a few members that agree with them away, leave the ones that don't behind.
In speaking for myself, I know Im not about to start any new club or join any others.
3) Everyone gets pissed, throws up their hands, cusses and swears to the point where no one wants anything to do with anyone and the club folds.
It seems this is the point where some of us are right now, but I still think/hope its fixable.
Scenario two is usually the better for all involved. The members of the old club that are happy with the way it runs stay behind and the new ones move onto to their club.
There's really never any way to please everyone. You oust the current leadership and the ones that liked him hate you and either stick around and make every effort to push you out the door and leave all together. Voting a new person in charge seems like a great idea, but there's never a way to please everyone, as soon as you start to try whatever you do please a few pisses off the rest. You might call it a dictatorship, but I've never seen a club survive any other way, you start trying to please everyone and meetings end up looking like a bunch of ladies arguing over what color ribbon to get for the summer ball... things go no where.
I understand about not pleasing everyone, that will always be the case. However, the last meeting that was held by the officers, I think went very well. There was topics discussed and the end result came about via a vote. So in a sense we have proven it can work.
As far as the money, usually you have no say over what it's spent on in a club. The people in charge make the decisions, if that pisses you off then you should have figured out where the money was going and what safety's were in order so that it didn't get spent on something you don't want it to be spent on.
Thats just it, the money that was collected never got spent. ALL club operations and events were being done at peoples own expense. Then upon the return of Ian, he basically accuses people of shady tactics inregards to the money.
Thanks for your insight and comments Phins, but as stated before there is quite a bit that went on people are not aware of. So thats where a lot of the confusion and frustrations are coming from.
12-24-2004, 12:05 AM
#37
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Ft Lauderdale, FL
Posts: 408
Originally Posted by Jims5543' date='Dec 23 2004, 11:20 PM
I honestly think the details are irrelavent at this point. What needs to be decided is if there is going to be a future with the MRCCFL.
I have discussed all this drama with Phins at great lengths and he already painted the picture described above for me. I am glad to see he took the time to comment here.
What some of you big players in the club need to decide is wether or not you can really walk away and not be involved in a club anymore.
I myself never liked clubs too much and this drama is exactly why. I was VERY VERY appreciative that Ian was able to negotiate a Rotary Owners appreciation day for the Mazda Rev It Up 2 years ago. The prompted me to get more involved in the club (it being my 1st ever event) and meeting a few of you there. John Fitz for one.
Then I met Damian and Mazdadrifter is right the guy knows how to promote a event like no other. He is an asset to MRCCFL and will be missed sorely.
I like Ian and have met him on a couple of occasions. I am sad to see MRCCFL has deteriorated to the point that it looks like it will break up.
I have read all you have typed and see where you are frustrated and from your side of the story it looks like you have a legit gripe.
Like I said before I am very NOT interested in being an officer of a club, but, am willing to help out in any way possible to better the Rotary community in Florida
But, the big question here is. Where do you go from here?? Another Club cetered around Damian, Jerry, Ron and Ken?? This is something you guys need to decide..
I have discussed all this drama with Phins at great lengths and he already painted the picture described above for me. I am glad to see he took the time to comment here.
What some of you big players in the club need to decide is wether or not you can really walk away and not be involved in a club anymore.
I myself never liked clubs too much and this drama is exactly why. I was VERY VERY appreciative that Ian was able to negotiate a Rotary Owners appreciation day for the Mazda Rev It Up 2 years ago. The prompted me to get more involved in the club (it being my 1st ever event) and meeting a few of you there. John Fitz for one.
Then I met Damian and Mazdadrifter is right the guy knows how to promote a event like no other. He is an asset to MRCCFL and will be missed sorely.
I like Ian and have met him on a couple of occasions. I am sad to see MRCCFL has deteriorated to the point that it looks like it will break up.
I have read all you have typed and see where you are frustrated and from your side of the story it looks like you have a legit gripe.
Like I said before I am very NOT interested in being an officer of a club, but, am willing to help out in any way possible to better the Rotary community in Florida
But, the big question here is. Where do you go from here?? Another Club cetered around Damian, Jerry, Ron and Ken?? This is something you guys need to decide..
Yes I think there is still a future for MRCCFL. There are still quite a few members left. I think what is not being noticed or said is that NONE of us wants the club to go away, fall apart or whatever. In speaking for myself, I know the time and effort that I have invested I don't want to see wasted. Im sure the others feel the same way.
Some people did leave by choice. But some are gone not by thier choice, but the choice of 1 person. Inregards to me leaving, this will not be of my own doing. I was asked/told to leave. So I won't stay where Im not wanted or appreciated.
I don't know about the rest of the guys, but Im not trying to start any new club to take away from MRCCFL. If I am gone from MRCCFL, my actions won't change. I will continue to do meets and such, the only difference will be it won't be titled MRCCFL presents.....
12-24-2004, 06:15 AM
#38
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 486
Originally Posted by Jims5543' date='Dec 24 2004, 12:20 AM
I was VERY VERY appreciative that Ian was able to negotiate a Rotary Owners appreciation day for the Mazda Rev It Up 2 years ago. The prompted me to get more involved in the club (it being my 1st ever event) and meeting a few of you there. John Fitz for one.
I really can't let this one slide.
Jim, I was the one who made all the phone calls and emails to get us into Mazda Rev It Up for free on Media Day. Ian might have said "Yeah, do it", but I did all the leg work and contacted the appropriate people.
If I recall, Ian was on vacation, as he had missed a BBQ and Road Rally at N-Tech a few weeks before Rev It Up.
12-24-2004, 07:58 AM
#39
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Jensen Beach, FL / Sylva, NC
Posts: 2,934
Originally Posted by JerryLH3' date='Dec 24 2004, 07:14 AM
I really can't let this one slide.
Jim, I was the one who made all the phone calls and emails to get us into Mazda Rev It Up for free on Media Day. Ian might have said "Yeah, do it", but I did all the leg work and contacted the appropriate people.
If I recall, Ian was on vacation, as he had missed a BBQ and Road Rally at N-Tech a few weeks before Rev It Up.
Jim, I was the one who made all the phone calls and emails to get us into Mazda Rev It Up for free on Media Day. Ian might have said "Yeah, do it", but I did all the leg work and contacted the appropriate people.
If I recall, Ian was on vacation, as he had missed a BBQ and Road Rally at N-Tech a few weeks before Rev It Up.
You see, outsider looking in syndrome. Again I understand all your frustrations now.
And thank you for doing that. It was awesome. I wish we could have done it again last year. At least we got a good turn out displaying cars.
I got to thinking about this whole deal.
I think the days of strong car clubs are passing. They were important years ago when there was no internet to communicate with. But now with forums and mailing lists etc... its very easy to organize and announce a meet for a certain kind of interest wether it be Z-cars or Porsches or RX-7's.
Damian is already planning a dyno day and it deosnt seem to be a MRCCFL event.
Also how many paid members are there? How many showed up at the Speedsource BBQ? A lot and a majority were RX7Club memebers and not MRCCFL members.
Dropping out of the elections for the MRCCFL isnt going to fix this. Jerry or Damian would be good logical next choices. I hope Brian does not get elected I do not like his agenda.
12-24-2004, 08:22 AM
#40
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 486
Good point on actual MRCCFL member attendance at events. At the last Tampa event we had, we had over 40 people and close to thirty rotary cars. Nine of them were MRCCFL members. A LOT of attendance is drawn from the people on the forums.
I thought I said I was done with this, LOL. Maybe the free exchange of ideas and the fact that all of us seem calm helps the discussion. Or maybe I'm past the point of being too involved and can give my opinions without too much worry over what happens next.
If I don't respon again, Merry Christmas everybody.
I thought I said I was done with this, LOL. Maybe the free exchange of ideas and the fact that all of us seem calm helps the discussion. Or maybe I'm past the point of being too involved and can give my opinions without too much worry over what happens next.
If I don't respon again, Merry Christmas everybody.