Is it possible?
01-25-2006, 01:45 PM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: PA
Posts: 354
Ok so I know the score - The logical way of turboing my GSL-SE would be swapping in an S5 TII motor. Cut and dry and done. I know.. I know...
Regardless, here's what I want to do...or more accurately...what I want to discuss on the forum:
I have the manifolds/ECU/turbo/intercooler/fuel parts from a '93 FD touring AT, but not the block itself, and I own a complete 1984 GSL-SE. Is it possible to combine parts and make a turboed FB, assuming I'll rebuild my motor with lower compression? Fabrication is not a problem.
If it's not possible with the parts on hand, what else would I need?
Not sure if this is in the appropriate area, so moderator please relocate if need be.
Regardless, here's what I want to do...or more accurately...what I want to discuss on the forum:
I have the manifolds/ECU/turbo/intercooler/fuel parts from a '93 FD touring AT, but not the block itself, and I own a complete 1984 GSL-SE. Is it possible to combine parts and make a turboed FB, assuming I'll rebuild my motor with lower compression? Fabrication is not a problem.
If it's not possible with the parts on hand, what else would I need?
Not sure if this is in the appropriate area, so moderator please relocate if need be.
01-29-2006, 02:17 PM
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,114
Originally Posted by 1gendreemer' post='796248' date='Jan 25 2006, 11:45 AM
Ok so I know the score - The logical way of turboing my GSL-SE would be swapping in an S5 TII motor. Cut and dry and done. I know.. I know...
Regardless, here's what I want to do...or more accurately...what I want to discuss on the forum:
I have the manifolds/ECU/turbo/intercooler/fuel parts from a '93 FD touring AT, but not the block itself, and I own a complete 1984 GSL-SE. Is it possible to combine parts and make a turboed FB, assuming I'll rebuild my motor with lower compression? Fabrication is not a problem.
If it's not possible with the parts on hand, what else would I need?
Not sure if this is in the appropriate area, so moderator please relocate if need be.
I personally would not do that? Is the engine in the FB still good?
The reason that I would not do this is because the SE has 2 injectors vs the FD having 4.
That is my opinion. Oh and here is a little motivation for you
01-29-2006, 03:02 PM
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 277
The manifolds will most likely not fit without an adaptor. The plug spacing on the rota housings match the chamber size on the high compression rotas and will not work as well on low compression rotas. Why swap out most of the engine to turbo it when you can just get a fd block bolt manifolds up . If the high compression engine is good may be it will help finance a turbo block.
01-30-2006, 11:03 AM
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: PA
Posts: 354
Thanks for the info! It's generated not only motivation, but more questions:
1. I looked at the respective intake and exhaust gaskets on the Mazdatrix site, and it looks like the bolt pattern is the same, though the ports don't look like they match perfectly. Still...workable. Also, is the comment about the injectors valid because won't I be using the ones from the FD? Educate me if I'm wrong?
2. Would a rebuilt (it will be rebuilt no matter what the outcome of this discussion), high compression GSL-SE motor stand up to this proposed setup if I had a boost controller and turned down the boost a little (still using the stock FD ECU)? After all, it does already have the 3mm apex seals and decent internal hardware.
Again, I just want to know if it's possible with the parts I have on hand. My reasons for wanting to do this are mainly sentimental, experimental, and financial (I got the FD parts for free). The finished car will be registered as a classic and babied...not driven every day.
Smack me if I'm dreaming. Help me if it's possible. Thanks again.
1. I looked at the respective intake and exhaust gaskets on the Mazdatrix site, and it looks like the bolt pattern is the same, though the ports don't look like they match perfectly. Still...workable. Also, is the comment about the injectors valid because won't I be using the ones from the FD? Educate me if I'm wrong?
2. Would a rebuilt (it will be rebuilt no matter what the outcome of this discussion), high compression GSL-SE motor stand up to this proposed setup if I had a boost controller and turned down the boost a little (still using the stock FD ECU)? After all, it does already have the 3mm apex seals and decent internal hardware.
Again, I just want to know if it's possible with the parts I have on hand. My reasons for wanting to do this are mainly sentimental, experimental, and financial (I got the FD parts for free). The finished car will be registered as a classic and babied...not driven every day.
Smack me if I'm dreaming. Help me if it's possible. Thanks again.
01-30-2006, 02:47 PM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,114
Originally Posted by 1gendreemer' post='797840' date='Jan 30 2006, 09:03 AM
Thanks for the info! It's generated not only motivation, but more questions:
1. I looked at the respective intake and exhaust gaskets on the Mazdatrix site, and it looks like the bolt pattern is the same, though the ports don't look like they match perfectly. Still...workable. Also, is the comment about the injectors valid because won't I be using the ones from the FD? Educate me if I'm wrong?
I cannot comment on the bolt patterns. As for the injectors there are only 2 in the SE. There are also 2 in the FD manifold(LIM). You would need some sort of EMS to control thes extra 2 injectors. I would not reccomend going turbo without an extra set of injectors.
2. Would a rebuilt (it will be rebuilt no matter what the outcome of this discussion), high compression GSL-SE motor stand up to this proposed setup if I had a boost controller and turned down the boost a little (still using the stock FD ECU)? After all, it does already have the 3mm apex seals and decent internal hardware.
Again, I just want to know if it's possible with the parts I have on hand. My reasons for wanting to do this are mainly sentimental, experimental, and financial (I got the FD parts for free). The finished car will be registered as a classic and babied...not driven every day.
Yes it is possible. Do a search there is a guy in this board that turbo'd a second gen block in a GSL-SE. He had a stand alone though.
Smack me if I'm dreaming. Help me if it's possible. Thanks again.
01-30-2006, 06:17 PM
#6
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: PA
Posts: 354
Cool, I'll start searching and I really appreciate it. I'm so excited about this possibility...well...I'm just excited. I still don't understand the injector situation though. If I get the electronics, and all the injectors from the FD, shouldn't I be ok? I feel like I'm being annoying by asking again, but I really just don't get it. 
Maybe it's just me not being clear that I will have everything I could want from the FD, except the short block (rotor housings, rotors, related internals)?
Basically, as I see it the main problem is the issue of fitting the FD intake and exhaust manifolds to my block, which shouldn't be enough of a change to make the stock FD ECU flip out and not be able to manage it. If anything, the GSL-SE block/ports will flow worse and put less stress on the electronics than the FD block.
Am I crazy and stupid?
Basically, as I see it the main problem is the issue of fitting the FD intake and exhaust manifolds to my block, which shouldn't be enough of a change to make the stock FD ECU flip out and not be able to manage it. If anything, the GSL-SE block/ports will flow worse and put less stress on the electronics than the FD block.
Am I crazy and stupid?
01-30-2006, 07:19 PM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,114
Originally Posted by 1gendreemer' post='798024' date='Jan 30 2006, 04:17 PM
Cool, I'll start searching and I really appreciate it. I'm so excited about this possibility...well...I'm just excited. I still don't understand the injector situation though. If I get the electronics, and all the injectors from the FD, shouldn't I be ok? I feel like I'm being annoying by asking again, but I really just don't get it.
Ok, this is where you run into a problem. Are you going to run TT? The FD maps are made for boost and will not work on a N/A application. The UIM/LIM should fit, that is not the problem though. The problem is that you need something to control those other 2 injectors. Currently you SE has only 2 so the comp only tells it to work those. I am not sure about this but you might be able to snag a S4 n/a ECU and use it. The 2nd gens had 4 injectors. This requires a lot of additional wiring. And to tell you the truth I am not really an expert in this field.
Basically, as I see it the main problem is the issue of fitting the FD intake and exhaust manifolds to my block, which shouldn't be enough of a change to make the stock FD ECU flip out and not be able to manage it. If anything, the GSL-SE block/ports will flow worse and put less stress on the electronics than the FD block.
I do not think that your main issue will be the fitment. That is fairly easy. A little time to match up the ports is all. The complexity comes in when you are trying to add an addition 2 injectors to the FB comp. Choose one or the other. FD comp or FB+standalone. The standalone will be much more expensive but will require a little less brainstorming. The FD maps are very unforgiving. That is the reason that you see 3rd gen owners getting a standalone after DP,MP exhaust and intake.
Am I crazy and stupid?
You are not crazy. But in my opinion you might as well go standalone. But I also have a little money to throw around. When money is an issue brainstorming is key.
01-30-2006, 08:00 PM
#8
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: PA
Posts: 354
Yeah we're just miscommunicating here. I have (and will use) the ECU from the 1993 rx7...not the one from my 1984 GSL-SE. Assuming I can get the manifolds to go on somehow, the setup will essentially BE exactly what comes stock in a 1993 rx7, twin turbos, intercooler, etc. The only difference is that I will use the 1984 housings/rotors. Thanks again for all the help!
...I considered stand alone, but since I'm using the higher compression rotors, I figure I won't be able to push any more than 8-10 lbs of boost and the stock 1993 ECU should be able to handle that without a problem. I was thinking if anything I'd have to "detune" that by adding a manual boost controller and bleeding some off.
...I considered stand alone, but since I'm using the higher compression rotors, I figure I won't be able to push any more than 8-10 lbs of boost and the stock 1993 ECU should be able to handle that without a problem. I was thinking if anything I'd have to "detune" that by adding a manual boost controller and bleeding some off.
01-30-2006, 08:01 PM
#9
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: PA
Posts: 354
Originally Posted by 1gendreemer' post='798057' date='Jan 30 2006, 06:00 PM
Yeah we're just miscommunicating here.
...I considered stand alone, but since I'm using the higher compression rotors, I figure I won't be able to push any more than 8-10 lbs of boost and the stock 1993 ECU should be able to handle that without a problem. I was thinking if anything I'd have to "detune" that by adding a manual boost controller and bleeding some off.
Also, it's going to be a PITA to get the 1993 wiring harness spliced into the 1984 car, but it's just reading diagrams...
01-31-2006, 02:09 PM
#10
Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: North Carolina, Pittsboro
Posts: 45
Good luck with that. Even if it doesn't work, you'll at least be rebuilding that motor (finally) and would presumably be seeing asphalt soon after?
Did you ever go back to get that cable from that junked audi?
Did you ever go back to get that cable from that junked audi?