what would u guys recomend for making more power in a NA 13b. I wanna do a carb kit i know to make my swap easier. I also have to rebuild the engine so i might be able to do internals when i do that. Also how much hp does the na 13b make.

standalone and nitrous. series 4 n/a makes 146 bhp or something, and series 5 makes around 160 i think?

i wanna go carb so that standalone wont work, this motor in going in a drift car so nitrous wont work, u think na will take just a few pounds of boost???

weld 6 ports closed, s4 rotars so theres higher compression, do LOTS of trany work. Get the miata gears so you have more brader power band. SUPER ULTRA lite flywheel. LSD. DONE



You don't need much power for a drift car. Just make sure power to waight ratio balenced.

know of a good high performance carb kit?????

weld 6 ports closed??

S4 rotors are higher compression than what?

super lightweight flywheel will kill the rotating enertia will make breaking traction more difficult (no clutch kicks..).. maybe a midweight flywheel will work. and yes, definitely an LSD.

street port, good carb, (well tuned), S5 rotors, 200+ easy....



S4 Rotars...9.4 comp.



S5 Rotars...9.7 comp.

look at the dyno sheet section of this site. look at some setups people are using and how they are working.

one more very technical question, on the front side of the accentric shaft, what size is the fitting of the hole in the end of it where the harmonic goes

you will only make more hp than stock if your carb setup is tuned reallly well.



ive seen alot of guys with carbs actually make less hp than stock EFI with same mods.

the reason im doing carb is so i dont have to deal with abunch of wiring when it get dropped into........ the ae86 of doom

ummmm. why are you using the old age technology of a carb? EFI is the easy way to go, and doing a stanalone with a specific wiring harness especially for a race purpose car will not be that messy. you can wire in the main fuse block and relays into the interior of the car.



GET CREATIVE! GO EFI!

naw im a carb kind of guy when it comes to old cars, plus i wanna go carb for other reasons

That's crazy talk! carb might be cheaper at first, but the time you will have to spend fuckalating with it to get everything dialed in, you'll wish you stayed efi.

without trying to flame you for using a carb and what not. i would like to help you out, but i have no idea what you are talking about here.... can you get a pic?

why would i have to spend money dialing it in???

You are talking about putting a carbed N/A 13B into an 86, the whole thing sounds like a money pit from the get go, so putting a carb on the engine is going to somehow make the swap easier?



It seems like that is he last possible thing you would want to do after putting an engine into a car that wasn't designed for it for the purpose of a drift car, the mounts have to be fabbed, the fuel delivery system will need to be adjusted, the suspension will need to be tuned, the running gear will need to be upgraded, not to mention any other complications that may arise, and after all that you want to take the essential plug and play of the efi/engine management application and pitch it in the dumpster to run a 1500.00? carb setup on an engine that might put 150hp to the street?



How much time will it take to get the carb tuned? what is your time worth? that is what i mean when i say it will cost you more time than what you can hope to earn in performance gains

Why go back in technology? Carbs are gay hard to tune fluctuate with air temps and humidity and make less power. Get a stand alone and a turbo, NA rotary’s are like lawnmowers. If you want NA power then put some spray on it.

Anybody in this thread actually run a carb on a rotary? Or just read about it on a forum?

these guys act like carbs are the worst thing in the world, u dont understand that i live in a race family and tuning carbs are easier than tuning a ems to me





and why is it evertime u tell somebody a project your doing they flame you about it, thats why the last few projects i did i kept to myself, fabbin up mounts, like thats a problem????? i have a shop







plus 150hp is MORE than enough for a ae86, they need serious chassis bracing around 200 or they start to fall apart and then u say i will have to do suspension tuning, welll duhhhhhh ill have to do that nomatter what engine i put in it , its a drift car that comes with the it, lol

yeah just port it, put some series 5 rotors in, do a few oil mods, make an intake manifold and exhaust system to make power where you want, play with some timing and you'll be fine... if you have the shop to do all this than what is the question?

I do. Its a 48DCOE from a Formula Mazda. Its a great carb but I still much perfer the standalone fuel computer I had previously. I switched to the carb to break in a new engine. The porting was different and I didn't want to deal with remapping a virgin engine to safely break it in. Now that its broke in I'm switching back to the stand alone using the factory intake and possibly some TWM 55mm throttle bodies in place of the 48DCOE.



kahren is my hero! He has proven you can make real good power with the factory intake and street porting. Its all in the tuning which the standalone makes possible. You just can't tune a carb as easily as you can adjust the mapping while the engine is running.



Standalone's rule!



How's that for a short story long?

I have a carbed 12A freshly rebuilt by me. Biggest piece of crap I have ever seen. Carbs are teh gayness.



I decided today I was going to EFI it. even after my 10hrs of labor fabricating a CAI for it. After porting the intakes after all kinds of other crap.



Carbs are old technology and flat out sux.

So cause YOU cant tune it, its "teh gayness"?



Good point..



Then a carb setup is perfect for you. Im a newb with carbs, and mine is set up well. Someone with experience and real knowledge should have no problems making more power over stock.



https://www.nopistons.com/forums/ind...howtopic=60354

ive run a couple of carb setups, and a couple of standalones, and they both can be a pain, and they both can run great, i like the kind of work a standalone needs better i think.

I'm doing an NA setup on my FC and I just put in the s4 4.10 LSD in and I got the 12a tranny sitting in my garage now, just waiting on buying my aluminum flywheel/exhaust.



I have an SAFCII but I haven't installed it yet



with some weight reduction my NA FC is gunna be a quick bastard.



oh yeah and its a streetport https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png

I love how you have the skillz to speculate I can't tune when I have the work to put your skillz in a hole and forgotten.

https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...1047683894.gif You and your "skillz" have put at least one engine "in a hole and forgotten".



This frustrated statement, to me says you couldnt get it tuned. Are you saying otherwise?



If someone cant get their EMS tuned, should that conclude that it is a "big piece of crap"? Or their skillz as a tuner isnt what they think it is.



Take from that what you will...

Nice :-/



I just finished retuning it today running perfect once again. It is the fact of the constant tuning as carbs change by elevation barometric pressure humidity and temp. They are never optimally tuned everywhere every day. I thought you knew this. EFI is not the case.



Your statement of producing more power or = then EFI is easily defeated. The power is not coming from the fuel that’s the least amount gained. As well EFI would be more precise on the mixture when tuned. But from the ignition map that is not tuned on carb setups.



The dude already has an EFI equipped motor and to run stand alone ignition modules on a carb could be dangerous but why when a EFI EMS could just be slapped on producing more efficient power all the time everywhere.

There is a simple fact of he will NOT produce more power with a carb then the stock EFI setup and an SAFC on stock fuel pulse. He will actually produce less without effective porting.

There is hardly a thread I see where you are helping somebody? Sheez.... Are you never happy, lol?





Needless to say, whatever he decides on carb or EFI... (probably carb) there will be tuning involved. If he is more comfortable with carb, than go carb. As far as a good setup? I'd use either the dellorto systems or a weber 48...the weber system will be the easiest to tune I would think and probably give you the best power output. The manifolds can be aquired from Racing Beat as well as the carbs. On a stock port, you should make plenty of power over the stock AE's powerplant.



Are you starting with an AE86 or an AE85? Just curious... also, not bashing..is this your first drift car and how good are you at driving... these things will actually make a difference in how you set the car up...

I can tell by your posts that you often misinterpret what is written. I said more power over stock.

No asterisk, no disclaimer, no footnotes. Well, maybe one **carb may not be well suited for the Pikes Peak hill climb as the high altitude may put your carb out of tune. See Iceblue for details** https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/bigok.gif



And im not putting down EMS of EFI in any way, but the stock equipment is JUNK. No matter what gimmic you attatch to it.

I was stating over stock EFI setup of the FC.

Here is a good exsample. Stock 12A nikki carb like mine. 100Bhp



Converted to TB fuel injection and E6k



Dyno run was 185rwhp



Builder was my friend Gonzz.

https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...1047683561.gif Thats a good example?

Stock system vs a modded one. You expected different?



And I think your forgetting to include a few mods in that setup.

I forgot no mods. Stock 12A nikki carb swapped out for the tweak-it TB injection. Only mod here is converting to EFI. Yea with an EMS.



So we are talking a carbed motor and same motor fuel injected. No different then going FI to carbed.



Like I said most power is in the ignition tuning something EFI offers in a package.

this is true, let's be honest. how many people have their correction maps dead on??? and being 'optimally tuned' is relative. bottom line is that the reason he doesn't go efi is because he doesn't want to. that's good enough reason for me??? i'm sure he's scared off this forum forever but if not let's try and give him a hand maybe?? that's why i come to this site... i think? https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...1047683664.gif

I always forget,



shop+set of tools+internet connection=mechanic/supercar builder



None of the above referenced scenarios are the end all when it comes to tuning performance



some rock a carb, some are wizards when it come to ems, I suppose individual ability isn't in question either...



getting to brass tacks: yes porting will be the way to make the most bang for your buck the the n/a platform in connection with the higher compression rotors and a damn good clutch, probably want to keep the original flywheel though.

185 RWHP on a stock 12a! At least 100% gain in power from only an EFI. More power than a stock TII?



All from a stock 12a.. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/bsflag.gif





I was trying to stop the bandwagon. Every time someone wants to run a carb, people come out of the woodwork to defend the honor of the fuel injector. And I was trying to display that most of who commented, dont have experience in the matter.



This is why I proposed adding a carburation forum on the board. That way it wouldnt get so many heroes.

I love how someone without experience can start calling bull **** like you truly know what’s up.



Ice Blue: GSL-SE

gonzz: yah will work

Ice Blue: I want to stick fuel injection on my SA

gonzz: do 12a plates and gsl-se housings

gonzz: oh

gonzz: use a center gsl-se

Ice Blu: Yea that’s what I was thinking

gonzz: i did a few of them

Ice Blu: I got one but it may be trashed got to go check

gonzz: the -se center has injector locations

Ice Blu: good good

gonzz: last one dynoed 185 rwhp

gonzz: good power

Ice Blu: im gona do that make a manifold and use a stock FC ECU

Ice Blu: That’s a big jump just buy fuel injection

Ice Blu: It was a stock 12a right 100bhp an they swapped to EFI on it

gonzz: installed the twek-it throttle body injection on the eng

gonzz: and a e6k

gonzz: pulled hard to 8500





I will ask him again tonight. If he realy did not port the motor.