Fd Abs And Steering Questions.
04-07-2005, 04:57 AM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Loss Vaygus, NV
Posts: 165
So, I have a 93 base, with some fun stuff done to her, but since the first day I owned her (7 months ago, give or take), I have had no ABS. Not really a big problem, but I'm probably about to put on the 929 MC and since I'll need lines bent anyway for that project, I've decided to either get the ABS working, or get it out completely.
The light only comes on at start-up, goes out, comes on again after moving a few feet, then stays on until I shut down. From what I remember, that's indicative of a bad sensor, but I haven't found out how to test them, nor have I found the link I had describing how to run the codes for this. I'm not sure if everything else is functional or not since I haven't run codes, but I'm sure as hell not going to take it to Mazda to find out (the last thing I need is my T04R in the hands of a 17 year old porter). I have the PFC, does that affect the ABS computer in any way? Any recommendations or insight would be helpful.
My second question has to do with power steering. I've heard mixed feelings on the removal of it, and since I like to try everything and see what works the best, I figured that one of these days, I'll just remove the belt and see how she feels for a quick jaunt around the neighborhood (knowing that if that feels good, then full removal should feel even better), then go from there. Now, if I decide I like it, what is the best thing to do with the rack? I've read that you should loop the lines, I've read that just plugging them is ok, what's the word from people who've done it? I don't want to blow the seals or run it dry, so I need a little guidance on what's best here. Is there a full manual rack available that will fit this car?
Apologies if the answers are right in front of my face somewhere (typical FNG stuff), I STFAed all I could and didn't find definitive responses.
The light only comes on at start-up, goes out, comes on again after moving a few feet, then stays on until I shut down. From what I remember, that's indicative of a bad sensor, but I haven't found out how to test them, nor have I found the link I had describing how to run the codes for this. I'm not sure if everything else is functional or not since I haven't run codes, but I'm sure as hell not going to take it to Mazda to find out (the last thing I need is my T04R in the hands of a 17 year old porter). I have the PFC, does that affect the ABS computer in any way? Any recommendations or insight would be helpful.
My second question has to do with power steering. I've heard mixed feelings on the removal of it, and since I like to try everything and see what works the best, I figured that one of these days, I'll just remove the belt and see how she feels for a quick jaunt around the neighborhood (knowing that if that feels good, then full removal should feel even better), then go from there. Now, if I decide I like it, what is the best thing to do with the rack? I've read that you should loop the lines, I've read that just plugging them is ok, what's the word from people who've done it? I don't want to blow the seals or run it dry, so I need a little guidance on what's best here. Is there a full manual rack available that will fit this car?
Apologies if the answers are right in front of my face somewhere (typical FNG stuff), I STFAed all I could and didn't find definitive responses.
04-07-2005, 09:43 AM
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Merrick NY / St.John's Uni Jamacia, NY
Posts: 1,073
as for powersteering i'd keep it, its not that much of a hinderance on power and if you plan on doing any harder driving its strong enough to keep up and definatly a lot easier than the forearm workout you'd get otherwise. ask martin (fikse...) if you want to hear an opinion of someone who regrets the move. smart move just testing with no belt see how it feels.
side bar.. where did you get those headlights assuming your sig is your car. im not a fan of non-pop-ups on out car but i like that look
side bar.. where did you get those headlights assuming your sig is your car. im not a fan of non-pop-ups on out car but i like that look
04-07-2005, 11:59 AM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 4,985
The PFC doesn't interfere with ABS operation.
The ABS computer is located in the boot (trunk) on the driver's side behind the interior trim. IIRC, when the wheels spin, the line voltage on the ABS sensor wires changes (not sure from what to what). There are four wheel speed sensors, so there are four feed wires. I can look those wire colors up when I get home.
Anyway, you're probably going to want to pull the ABS computer and test the line voltage at each wire. The one that doesn't change will be your problem sensor. Subsequently that sensor should be replaced.
I'm sure there's a diagnostic procedure using the ABS computer to trigger an 'ABS code', but I'm not sure what it is.
Interesting thing about ABS sensors, they need to be relatively close to the trigger ring (1mm max, IIRC) and they need to be clean. You might try visual inspection and adjustment (if there is any) before you go through manual diagnostic of the sensor output voltage.
I will see what I can find on ABS diagnostics and/or sensor wire colors in the FSM CD tonight.
The ABS computer is located in the boot (trunk) on the driver's side behind the interior trim. IIRC, when the wheels spin, the line voltage on the ABS sensor wires changes (not sure from what to what). There are four wheel speed sensors, so there are four feed wires. I can look those wire colors up when I get home.
Anyway, you're probably going to want to pull the ABS computer and test the line voltage at each wire. The one that doesn't change will be your problem sensor. Subsequently that sensor should be replaced.
I'm sure there's a diagnostic procedure using the ABS computer to trigger an 'ABS code', but I'm not sure what it is.
Interesting thing about ABS sensors, they need to be relatively close to the trigger ring (1mm max, IIRC) and they need to be clean. You might try visual inspection and adjustment (if there is any) before you go through manual diagnostic of the sensor output voltage.
I will see what I can find on ABS diagnostics and/or sensor wire colors in the FSM CD tonight.
04-07-2005, 12:02 PM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 4,985
Also, you are correct with your diagnostic of a WSS. The light sequencing you reported is 1)Light on: ABS computer self-diagnostic 2)Light off: ABS self-diag OK 3)Light On after roll: ABS sensor failure.
04-09-2005, 02:19 PM
#6
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Loss Vaygus, NV
Posts: 165
Thanks for the suggestions, I'l have to get her up on stands with a voltmeter this weekend to see if I can test the sensors.
Regarding the power steering, my goal isn't so much for power gain as it is for increased steering feedback. Of course if effort is increased too much that will negate any benefits, so that's why I just think I need to try it and see. She is just a weekend and late night toy so it's not like I have to dodge SUVs everyday. Besides, my other toy is a '66 Mustang with no PS and a 320mm wheel, so I've already got the Popeye look going on with my forearms.
Fiske, beside the increased effort, what other things did you notice with doing this mod? Was feel improved? The other issue is that I get the back way out a lot, and it seems that the steering tightens up after half a turn or so during big fast countersteer measures, I was hoping I could eliminate that as well.
And thanks about the headlights, I really liked the lights on the AsparaDrink FD, so I'm in the process of building these, I'm on plan D, but I think I've got it figured out now. The pic is actually a PhotoShop I did to see if the idea in my head really looked good when I saw it on the car. They should come out very nice, plus I'll have the only set like that on a street FD.
Regarding the power steering, my goal isn't so much for power gain as it is for increased steering feedback. Of course if effort is increased too much that will negate any benefits, so that's why I just think I need to try it and see. She is just a weekend and late night toy so it's not like I have to dodge SUVs everyday. Besides, my other toy is a '66 Mustang with no PS and a 320mm wheel, so I've already got the Popeye look going on with my forearms.
Fiske, beside the increased effort, what other things did you notice with doing this mod? Was feel improved? The other issue is that I get the back way out a lot, and it seems that the steering tightens up after half a turn or so during big fast countersteer measures, I was hoping I could eliminate that as well.
And thanks about the headlights, I really liked the lights on the AsparaDrink FD, so I'm in the process of building these, I'm on plan D, but I think I've got it figured out now. The pic is actually a PhotoShop I did to see if the idea in my head really looked good when I saw it on the car. They should come out very nice, plus I'll have the only set like that on a street FD.
04-09-2005, 02:42 PM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2002
Location: California
Posts: 22,465
[quote name='Sinful7' date='Apr 7 2005, 08:59 AM']The PFC doesn't interfere with ABS operation.
The ABS computer is located in the boot (trunk) on the driver's side behind the interior trim. IIRC, when the wheels spin, the line voltage on the ABS sensor wires changes (not sure from what to what). There are four wheel speed sensors, so there are four feed wires. I can look those wire colors up when I get home.
Anyway, you're probably going to want to pull the ABS computer and test the line voltage at each wire. The one that doesn't change will be your problem sensor. Subsequently that sensor should be replaced.
I'm sure there's a diagnostic procedure using the ABS computer to trigger an 'ABS code', but I'm not sure what it is.
Interesting thing about ABS sensors, they need to be relatively close to the trigger ring (1mm max, IIRC) and they need to be clean. You might try visual inspection and adjustment (if there is any) before you go through manual diagnostic of the sensor output voltage.
I will see what I can find on ABS diagnostics and/or sensor wire colors in the FSM CD tonight.
[/quote]
you're right on steviepoo. i think the abs comp has the ability to give you codes, but i think you need a special tool for it
The ABS computer is located in the boot (trunk) on the driver's side behind the interior trim. IIRC, when the wheels spin, the line voltage on the ABS sensor wires changes (not sure from what to what). There are four wheel speed sensors, so there are four feed wires. I can look those wire colors up when I get home.
Anyway, you're probably going to want to pull the ABS computer and test the line voltage at each wire. The one that doesn't change will be your problem sensor. Subsequently that sensor should be replaced.
I'm sure there's a diagnostic procedure using the ABS computer to trigger an 'ABS code', but I'm not sure what it is.
Interesting thing about ABS sensors, they need to be relatively close to the trigger ring (1mm max, IIRC) and they need to be clean. You might try visual inspection and adjustment (if there is any) before you go through manual diagnostic of the sensor output voltage.
I will see what I can find on ABS diagnostics and/or sensor wire colors in the FSM CD tonight.
[snapback]696526[/snapback]
[/quote]
you're right on steviepoo. i think the abs comp has the ability to give you codes, but i think you need a special tool for it
04-09-2005, 02:47 PM
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2002
Location: California
Posts: 22,465
[quote name='SilverSeven' date='Apr 9 2005, 11:19 AM']Thanks for the suggestions, I'l have to get her up on stands with a voltmeter this weekend to see if I can test the sensors.
Regarding the power steering, my goal isn't so much for power gain as it is for increased steering feedback. Of course if effort is increased too much that will negate any benefits, so that's why I just think I need to try it and see. She is just a weekend and late night toy so it's not like I have to dodge SUVs everyday. Besides, my other toy is a '66 Mustang with no PS and a 320mm wheel, so I've already got the Popeye look going on with my forearms.
Fiske, beside the increased effort, what other things did you notice with doing this mod? Was feel improved? The other issue is that I get the back way out a lot, and it seems that the steering tightens up after half a turn or so during big fast countersteer measures, I was hoping I could eliminate that as well.
And thanks about the headlights, I really liked the lights on the AsparaDrink FD, so I'm in the process of building these, I'm on plan D, but I think I've got it figured out now. The pic is actually a PhotoShop I did to see if the idea in my head really looked good when I saw it on the car. They should come out very nice, plus I'll have the only set like that on a street FD.
[/quote]
when we were actually driving the fd's hard in the mountains, i did some back to backing of ps vs no ps.
no ps does give you more feed back, but i found the effort increase was high enough that instead of driving the right line i was working on just getting the wheel turned. and with bigger tires (275/35/17's) hitting a bump in a turn litterally rips the wheel out of your hands without the ps.
i do think the ps is over assisted but i found i was faster with the ps, because i could concentrate on putting the car on the right line better.
take the belt off, see what you think, i was suprised none of my other cars have ps...
Regarding the power steering, my goal isn't so much for power gain as it is for increased steering feedback. Of course if effort is increased too much that will negate any benefits, so that's why I just think I need to try it and see. She is just a weekend and late night toy so it's not like I have to dodge SUVs everyday. Besides, my other toy is a '66 Mustang with no PS and a 320mm wheel, so I've already got the Popeye look going on with my forearms.
Fiske, beside the increased effort, what other things did you notice with doing this mod? Was feel improved? The other issue is that I get the back way out a lot, and it seems that the steering tightens up after half a turn or so during big fast countersteer measures, I was hoping I could eliminate that as well.
And thanks about the headlights, I really liked the lights on the AsparaDrink FD, so I'm in the process of building these, I'm on plan D, but I think I've got it figured out now. The pic is actually a PhotoShop I did to see if the idea in my head really looked good when I saw it on the car. They should come out very nice, plus I'll have the only set like that on a street FD.
[snapback]697447[/snapback]
[/quote]
when we were actually driving the fd's hard in the mountains, i did some back to backing of ps vs no ps.
no ps does give you more feed back, but i found the effort increase was high enough that instead of driving the right line i was working on just getting the wheel turned. and with bigger tires (275/35/17's) hitting a bump in a turn litterally rips the wheel out of your hands without the ps.
i do think the ps is over assisted but i found i was faster with the ps, because i could concentrate on putting the car on the right line better.
take the belt off, see what you think, i was suprised none of my other cars have ps...
04-22-2005, 03:25 PM
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 117
trying out "manual" steering by removing the belt from the power steering pump is the worst of two worlds.
you are moving all the hydraulic fluid around in addition to turning the wheels without the power assist!
no road feel
huge effort required.
that's not manual steering.
manual steering is a breeze.
there is no need for power steering on a 2800 pound sportscar. i run 18X9 fronts and i love the road feel as well as more room for air to circulate in the eng compartment and less front weight.
power steering is my favorite mod since 99
go for it
howard coleman
you are moving all the hydraulic fluid around in addition to turning the wheels without the power assist!
no road feel
huge effort required.
that's not manual steering.
manual steering is a breeze.
there is no need for power steering on a 2800 pound sportscar. i run 18X9 fronts and i love the road feel as well as more room for air to circulate in the eng compartment and less front weight.
power steering is my favorite mod since 99
go for it
howard coleman
04-22-2005, 06:23 PM
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Disclaimer: posts made after 11AM are most likely alcohol induced. Please disregard unless very funn
Posts: 2,436
As far as the ABS being jacked up..... check to see if your rear wiper fuse is good (whether you have rear wiper or not) ...it feeds a circuit on the ABS computer.
