Anybody have a map available to them for a safe amount of ignition advance from vac to 15psi on stock turbo (1991 13BT)



FMIC

550/1600

Walbro

FPR

FJO



I have the fuel map taken care of I just dont know how to set up ignition map. Is hitmans stock 13bt map safe, should I advance more? I need it to be safe on 91 Pump.

Check out the haltch map section, I have a map with ignition mapping setup very good.

make sure your timing is setup correctly and it is 100% accurate!

94: Is your map for a s5 turbo?



Vosko: I lined up timing hitmans method, will check with timing light before boosting.

No its not, but the timing should be the same.

yup verify with a timing light to make sure its zero'd out. its very important. timing is gonna be very similar for differrent setups. if you want you can also run very little flat across the board just to make sure the E6K is controlling the timing right

i dont think the 2 maps are gonna be that different, but i was gonna say if you're unsure go about 1/2 way and see how the car likes it



mike

Yeah just listen to make sure you don't get any ignition breakup while your going wide open. If you do you may want to retard it a bit. The ignition in my map works perfect for me, if I raise it 3 degrees it begins to break up in the higher rpms.

I try not to run over 17' adv on the plugs at 15 psi and no more than 15' adv above 17psi to be safe from 7000 rpm up... Loosing a few HP and not killing the engine is :bigthumg: ....

yah, sometimes less timing is not a bad thing.



mike

I run 3 less degree from optium for safety.

Dragon, I plan on running 15psi max on 91, do you run 17* across the positive pressure load map or do you start with a larger advance and work down? What is your max advance under boost?

91 octane

actually it's much more andvance on the vaccume and lower boost areas and works its way down as the boost comes up, I also run almost no split in the no boost areas and increase the split as it comes in to the peak tork and boost areas then I reduce the split to about 5' under peak boost after it comes out of peak tork...



lol.. hope you can understand all that how I worded it.. It's kinda hard to put in to words..

yah, i was gonna say look at a power fc map, they are running 30-40degress advance in vacuum



mike

Here are some screen shots of my ing map, the fist one is for refrence of the N and P blocks.

Leading Map

Trailing Map

Ignition split between leading and trailing

The map I'm running could be more agressive, but like I said before I'm happy to loose a couple ponies to keep the apex seals intact...

I'm going to pin this for future reference and please feel free to add any ing maps you have that you feel are safe or post any documentation you may have on ignition in general on a rotary engine.

Thanks for the info Dragon.

hey dragon do you notice a difference between zero split and the normal split in vacuum? i do it seems much more responsive, and it seems to like less total advance



mike

definitly better response with the no split, it also help with getting the boost up quicker... Ie. give it gas and the wastgate is open in no time, ass end sliding around.. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png much fun... I'm running a pretty good size ex port and decent size intake port...

I can't see the pictures dragon :(



I still don't know what to do about timing, timing is way to retarded. Losing alot of power i think.

I fixed/updated all the pic's above to the ign map I'm running now.. It's a little more agressive that what I had posted before, but still a good safe ign map.. Enjoy..

Dragon,



Where is your torque peak? How does your knock look at it? Send me a PM.



Tony

Dragon,

I thought you were running more than 1.4bar but noticed your map references (pimm scaling) are stock. Are you still running under under 1.4 bar?

I'm running the E6k and we can't adjust split as indepth as the power fc. Only 0-2000 rpm and 2000+!

G-damn.. haven't looked in here for a while.. That's a really old map, my current map is written out to 1.6 but I have boosted 1.7 on it.. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png Peak tork is around 6,500- 7,500 rpm.. It peaks and then just stays there for 1,000 rpm.. I have a awsom 5,750-8,000 rpm tork area.. it builds fast and then just holds for ever.. Makes the car so much fun to drive it just accelerates smooth and hard boosting 1.6 kgcm, lol it's so smooth I though the car got slower with the new port, but it's so much faster.. I have a fucken huge side port by the way with only 1.5mm's of corner seal ride and a exaust port a large squirel could crawl threw..

Dragon - what AFR are you running under boost, and what octane fuel is this on? Do you use water injection, or anything else like it?



Seems like a lot of timing to me!



Thanks

Manolis

http://www.countercultured.net/pics/ignition.jpg



For reference, 100 = 20 psi, 107 = 23 psi, around 40 is 0psi

Wow that is the first time I ever seen a Wolf Screen. So you have decimal points in your ignition timing??



Excuse me if I sound stupid I just never imagined running 14.1degrees of timing.

well i put in 14, it rounded *laugh*

Haltech E11 is able to adjust to the 0.1 of a degree also if you want it to. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/smile.png





-Ted

i wonder if the engine is even accurate to .01...

How is load figured? I can understand psi x rpm. But what exactly is load, and how is that figured?

Load is the MAP pressure. 40 is his differentiation between vacuum and boost.

I would like to add to this thread, that if you are playing with timing you should have atleast 1 EGT gauge. As power levels, boost and compression levels rise, combustion pressure will also rise, and timing becomes a lot more critical. No engine is the same, almost everyone engine will need to be tuned differently. Most people just play it safe and do a conservative tune.

I posed a similar question in the ECU discussion with little response then found this thread. Good info.



I printed your map, while generic, its a good baseline to work off of. I had Steve Kahn tune my car and the timing was scary at best.



I had 19-23 BTDC at 16 PSI at 6500 RPM and it scared me.



I already killed an engine on the dyno and I am a firm believer of leaving HP in and name of longer engine life.



Thanks for the maps. I wish I could understand the Haltech maps but they make no sense to me at all.



This wolf map is similar to my Motec map and will come in handy. Time to pull out some timing before I break in the engine and see some serious boost. (400 miles to go https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub... )

Jim,



19-23btdc L timing is all relative. What afr were you at? in the 10s? I definitely prefer leaner afr vs more timing, Nyt's map looks pretty conservative to me, but he might be running 11.9 afr on a big single etc.. Power levels make a huge difference in what you can get away with.