jwteknix

well I'm at the point where I really wana take up and start to learn how to weld.

I know the purpuse and function. Welding is a fabrication process that joins materials, usually metals or thermoplastics, by causing coalescence. This is often done by melting the workpieces and adding a filler material to form a pool of molten material (the weld puddle) that cools to become a strong joint, with pressure sometimes used in conjunction with heat, or by itself, to produce the weld.(as per wikipedia)



Now i know there is many different types of welding mig, tig, arc and so on, but what is the differrence is mig just for steel and other hard metals?, is tig just for aluminum? do the welds have differenrt purposes, strenghts, or other caracteristics between one another?



I dont own a welder. If I was to go purchase one for myself what should be looked? at anything specific? how much do they cost? ****, where do I get one? are they all 220v or do they make 110v too? Just looking for general information that can in the future help out this forum section and some other people looking to also experiment, so that we dont have to pay some one to do something relatetivly easy and it gives us the opportunity to make and fabricate our own **** into whatever we want.

James

1988RedT2

There's some great welding forums on the web. My brother sends me links all the time.



As with all tool purchases, you must first identify your needs, then buy an appropriate welder. 110-v models exist, but have their limitations.



This is a pretty good spot. Check out the rest of the site--they have a lot of info:

http://www.hobartwelders.com/weldtalk/

jwteknix

awsome, ill check out that site. In the mean time anyone elses have some advice? you know, **** you've learn while welding over the years and what not. I know there are some experienced people on here. lets here some more!!

RX200013B

I would not recomend the 110v welder, not very clean welds and can't do to much. i don't think it would be good for a intake or anything like that!

dac

I couldn't disagree with you more. I have a Lincon wirefeed and it has welded everything I have ever needed. It's super easy to use and affordable, plus you aren't blowing holes in everything.



I did my motor mounts, transmission mount, roll bar and seat brackets. I don't have the optional bottle for it and use flux wire. Sure it's no TIG welder, but it's great for just about anyone.

mazdaspeed7

3 main types of electric welders: First is stick or arc welding. It uses flux coated electrodes held in a clamp to do the welding. Good for fast and strong welds on thick material (1/4"+) and its most common in an industrial setting. Not a good choice for car related fab work. Next is MIG. This is your typical wire fed welder. You can either use a shielding gas, or use flux core wire. A very good choice for moderately thin to moderately thick pieces. Its easy to use, and is very fast. If you want to learn to weld, get this type of machine. TIG uses a tungsten electrode to create the arc to the workpiece, and you hold a filler rod into the weld puddle to add material. This method of welding is the most difficult of the electric welders to be proficient at, and it is the slowest. But you are rewarded with very pretty welds, and can weld materials the other types have a hard time with.



Forget a stick welder, it has no place for car related fab work. TIG machines are very expensive(they start at about $1k if you want to do aluminum), and the welds take time. It also takes 2 hands, so its hard to hold something in place to tack weld it with tig. But if you do much aluminum welding, you want to use an AC tig. DC current does a somewhat poor job on aluminum. MIG welders are DC current, which limits what they can do with aluminum. The small buzz box tig welders also are dc only, and will not work on aluminum. DC TIG welding of aluminum is very hard to get a good weld with, so dont consider it a viable option. MIG welders do ok with aluminum, but the welds wont be pretty. Also, its hard to control the current with MIG. Intake manifolds and repair work and such can be done with MIG on aluminum, but if you plan on doing much tubing, look towards TIG.



Welder selection: Ill keep this MIG specific, since I havent done much TIG shopping before. Stick with the name brands. Hobart, miller, and lincoln all make quality welders. Hobart is the consumer level of the miller brand, which is aimed more towards commercial users(and the price reflects this). Lincoln is pretty comparable to hobart. One thing to look for is what your local welding supply carries consumables for. Having a lincoln machine and only being able to get miller parts locally could delay projects having to wait for parts. Other than that, some of the key features to look for are amperage range settings and duty cycle. The more settings for amperage you have, the better you will be able to fine tune the machine to weld different thickness materials. Duty cycle is the ratio of time welding vs time cooling. Higher is better. Most 110v welders, and I believe the lincoln 220v welders have a 20% duty cycle. For every 10 minutes, you can only spend 2 actually welding at the highest setting with that. My hobart(handler 187) has a 35% duty cycle. 110v welders start having trouble getting adequate penetration on as thin as 1/8" steel with solid core wire and gas shielding. Flux core does a little better. For that reason, I would stick with a 220v machine if at all possible.



Shielding gas: For steel, you want to use an argon/C02 mix. The C02 keeps the carbon content up in the weld giving it good strength. It works great for mild steel, but makes welds on stainless look "dirty." For non-structural applications, I use 100% argon for stainless. You also have to use 100% argon for aluminum. Keep that in mind if you plan on welding both. You will need seperate bottles.



My welder is a Hobart handler 187. I have added an aluminun conversion to it, and made a custom cart. Ill detail the cart construction in a howto. Its a great beginner fab project. The aluminum conversion consisted of a new liner for the gun, and going up to .035 wire. The cart was custom built to hold 2 160cf gas bottles as well as the welder.

jwteknix

wow that answers just about everything. awsome info mazdaspeed looking forward to seeing you cart write up. I just thought this section needed somthing like this because most fabrication involves welding. This should be pinned. if any one can add anymore to what mazdaspeed has said please do.

James

mazdaspeed7

Ill go in detail on the specifics to welding itself tomorrow. But I highly recommend picking up a good book on welding. The majority of welding is knowing how to set the machine up, and how to "read" the welds you are making.

Lynn E. Hanover

This is a tough question, because there are lots of correct answers depending on who is reading them. Stop by and I will teach you to weld in two hours. I have done this for folks who had trouble holding the filler rod for more than a few seconds.



I told one friend who was crazy to drive race cars that if he helped me build the next one, he could drive it.



We started off with brazing. He said it needed welding. I pointed out that every British race car imported up to that point had been brazed, even the roll over structures. I show him how to braze a few scraps together.



So I started cutting and fitting tubes for the toe box and he was brazing up a storm. No overheating, good looking fillets the whole thing. So by lunch time we had a toe box with clutch and brake bottle mounts, and I was fitting tubes to mount the front suspension. He says, this is practice right? I say no, thats the front end of the new car. He gets this look on his face like astronaughts are going into space in this thing he made.



I don't know how to braze he says. So I have him braze a 3/4' square tube into the side of a 1" square tube. We let it cool and eat lunch. I put a pipe wrench on the 3/4" tube and let him try to twist it off of the 1" tube. No good. We add a long pipe to the pipe wrench handle and wind the 3/4" tube up like a rubber band. We take a bite closer to the braze, and the wall of the 1" tube fails and a chunk peels off. Up to the mid 30s all aircraft were brazed. So, Roger Schroer the worlds fastest man in an electric car

(Buckeye Bullet 318 MPH) brazed most of the chassis together.



The use of an acetylene oxygen welding and brazing is the basic welding outfit. You can weld aluminum, steel, and iron castings. You can heat things up to break press fits and tapers. You can form metals into complex shapes. If you get a snoot full you can breath pure oxygen for a while and avoid a headache.



Don't stand bottles up that are not chained to a wall.



Once the basics are understood, the move to TIG is easy, just a different heat source. I found MIG a bit more difficult to pick up. I did semi trailer floors with aluminum MIG, but nothing worked until we got stainless buffer wheels to clean the floors. Also the cabs on Harvesters were always cracking up a spot welded seam. Fixed hundreds of them. When the company saw our repairs, we got every cab they had.



No doubt that a conventional hand set, and an aircraft hand set for acetylene is the best start. Also check for welding courses at the local schools in the summer, or a trade school. Some as cheap as 100 for a 3 week course.



Lynn E. Hanover



The picture is the amature built brazed chassis with Lola running gear and a rotary engine FT-200 Hewland dog ring trans.

jwteknix

wow this thread keeps hetting Better and better lynn awsome I had no idea that you could also braze instead of weld I'm sure it only certain things but I'm actually really good at brazing I've been doing it for a while with my father mostly on copper for rebuilding large central a/c units. And **** I wish you were closer I'd take you up on the teachin lesson LOL any way guys keep it coming im learning a ton

James