Rx8 Ported Plates...?
03-12-2005, 01:04 AM
#32
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: S. Florida
Posts: 629
If the head engine guru for Speed Source comes out and says the stock ports have been optimized by the factory and they can't get any hp out of them (even using a stand-alone Motec!) by porting, I tend to believe them.
But...I certainly don't know you nor your engine testing facilities or rotary experience. I don't know what sort of testing parameters you are using to port these engines, test the flow, etc..poor dyno calibration can account for much more than a 16hp difference.
I'm a doubting thomas. More solid info needed!
Michel
But...I certainly don't know you nor your engine testing facilities or rotary experience. I don't know what sort of testing parameters you are using to port these engines, test the flow, etc..poor dyno calibration can account for much more than a 16hp difference.
I'm a doubting thomas. More solid info needed!
Michel
03-12-2005, 03:27 AM
#33
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 426
Originally Posted by rx7tt95' date='Mar 11 2005, 11:04 PM
If the head engine guru for Speed Source comes out and says the stock ports have been optimized by the factory and they can't get any hp out of them (even using a stand-alone Motec!) by porting, I tend to believe them.
But...I certainly don't know you nor your engine testing facilities or rotary experience. I don't know what sort of testing parameters you are using to port these engines, test the flow, etc..poor dyno calibration can account for much more than a 16hp difference.
I'm a doubting thomas. More solid info needed!
Michel
But...I certainly don't know you nor your engine testing facilities or rotary experience. I don't know what sort of testing parameters you are using to port these engines, test the flow, etc..poor dyno calibration can account for much more than a 16hp difference.
I'm a doubting thomas. More solid info needed!
Michel
car was dyno'd at the same place, air temp was within 8 degrees.
i don't know why they didn't get more power with a standalone. lots of guys get a lot more power from just an emanage or canzoomer. i'm not trying to insult the head engine guru at speed source, but you CAN get more power from porting and tuning. maybe you misunderstood something?
03-12-2005, 03:46 AM
#34
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: CT
Posts: 1,345
i am pretty sure it was speed source that i read the inforamation about, that they got 30 more whp after spending 2 weeks on the dyno just tuning the car. i will look into this to confirm it.
also gjunkie, did you guys have the latest mazda flash on that car before performing any modifications?
from what ive seen most rx8s put out over 180whp and itos being the highest at 197 like MS7 stated. ito did run 100 octane or hihger i belive to get that number, he also mentioned the car gettign faster with hihger octane, very beliveable if regular octane does cause a higher knock reading and therfore retarding the timing. so i do belive the higher output with a more advanced timing map that the ecu would run. 160 stock that you guys got is pretty low.
also if the dynoes you pasted are corrected then the air temp difffrences wont make a much of a diffrence readign teh power output. thats what the correction factors are there for in the first palce, so you can compare the output at diffrent test conditions and weather changes assuming the dyno software is seetup properly at your dyno facility.
also gjunkie, did you guys have the latest mazda flash on that car before performing any modifications?
from what ive seen most rx8s put out over 180whp and itos being the highest at 197 like MS7 stated. ito did run 100 octane or hihger i belive to get that number, he also mentioned the car gettign faster with hihger octane, very beliveable if regular octane does cause a higher knock reading and therfore retarding the timing. so i do belive the higher output with a more advanced timing map that the ecu would run. 160 stock that you guys got is pretty low.
also if the dynoes you pasted are corrected then the air temp difffrences wont make a much of a diffrence readign teh power output. thats what the correction factors are there for in the first palce, so you can compare the output at diffrent test conditions and weather changes assuming the dyno software is seetup properly at your dyno facility.
03-12-2005, 03:56 AM
#35
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 426
the car had the l flash, so we kept it like that after the porting. we did plan on having the latest flash performed after the "dry" dyno run, and then cat removal and tuning.
what i've heard from most rx8 owners is lower octane gas is getting them more power. it's not impossible, but i doubt the motor would be pinging with zero overlap and afr's in the low 12's.
yes, hp was dismal stock. the owner felt cheated
i'd like to try the porting on a car that had decent power stock (since there seems to be "good" ones and "bad" ones.)
but even though we gained hp, the most important thing is the butt-dyno!! the car just feels more alive and awake now! AND it's getting better gas milage too (most likely from the exhaust porting)
what i've heard from most rx8 owners is lower octane gas is getting them more power. it's not impossible, but i doubt the motor would be pinging with zero overlap and afr's in the low 12's.
yes, hp was dismal stock. the owner felt cheated
i'd like to try the porting on a car that had decent power stock (since there seems to be "good" ones and "bad" ones.)but even though we gained hp, the most important thing is the butt-dyno!! the car just feels more alive and awake now! AND it's getting better gas milage too (most likely from the exhaust porting)
03-12-2005, 04:52 AM
#36
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: CT
Posts: 1,345
the car can still ping if the timing is advanced enough with the afrs around 12.
therefore the knock sensor can still sence SOME knock and keep retarding timing to try to get a lower reading and therfore will make less power. power will only go down after detonation is severe so until that point the power will be goign up.
i do belive that 87 octane is the best for older rotaries with stock EMS, since the stock timing is somewhat conservative. on teh rx8 though i dont think its the case.
and using higher octane will most liekly net more power, and itos car is one example that comes to mind, i do not know anyone else with an rx8 that dynoed with higer then 93 octane.
therefore the knock sensor can still sence SOME knock and keep retarding timing to try to get a lower reading and therfore will make less power. power will only go down after detonation is severe so until that point the power will be goign up.
i do belive that 87 octane is the best for older rotaries with stock EMS, since the stock timing is somewhat conservative. on teh rx8 though i dont think its the case.
and using higher octane will most liekly net more power, and itos car is one example that comes to mind, i do not know anyone else with an rx8 that dynoed with higer then 93 octane.
03-12-2005, 04:23 PM
#40
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: California
Posts: 22,465
Originally Posted by Jeff20B' date='Mar 12 2005, 12:18 PM
This is probably a rookie question, but what ever became of that whole 'RX-8 speed sensors on the front wheels not allowing great results on a chassis dyno' thing? Any truth to it? Or was it just another 
on Mazda's part?
there is something to it. we had an -8 on the rack the other day to check for a noise, and floored the ecu let me have 20mph. i turned off the traction control, and it didnt do anything, until i rolled the window down, then the ecu let me have all 238hp!
so even with the traction control on, its still doing stuff with the windows up