sailin...
12-23-2007, 07:35 PM
#1
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 3,928
thinkin about gettin one of these...
hopin to get enough experience under my belt to operate one of these in several years..
been wantin to do this for a while.. never too sure when the right time is..
might have to move first.. any pointers scott.. rob..
its either this or start buildin the spec miata for regional competition..
hopin to get enough experience under my belt to operate one of these in several years..
been wantin to do this for a while.. never too sure when the right time is..
might have to move first.. any pointers scott.. rob..
its either this or start buildin the spec miata for regional competition..
12-23-2007, 09:42 PM
#2
Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stuart, FL
Posts: 24,416
Now is always better then later. You have a few options, the first is to sign up with one of the ASA schools, pay some bucks and get the basics, then decide what size boat you want to stay with for a while, buy it and apply the basics. The second is to buy a small trailerable day sailor and bounce around the lakes and bays to get the basics down, let's face it sailing isnt rocket science, its one of the very few things that has change little if at all in the past 500+ years ,then when you've got things down sell the small boat and buy something bigger.
Anyhow, that aside you'll get a million opinions as to what boat is best, what size is best and most them won't be anywhere near what you need or want. My first question would be what are you going to use it for? Weekend sails on nice days close to shore? Sailing around the world spending a lot of long periods on the boat? Weekends and short trips? I can definetely make some suggestions if I know what your plans are. There's a lot of production boats that I wouldn't want to wander more then a few miles offshore in due to design and build quality, however a lot of people steer clear of them thinking they will sail the world and never end up doing so.... wasting a lot of money. I could go on for days, but why bother since i dunno exactly what you are thinking.
I dunno if you are specifically looking at the elan 344 or not, I've never sailed on so i can't comment on the sailing characteristics, they are very popular in Europe and from what little i know about them they have a good build quality. A lot of them are used as charters, so don't buy an ex-charter unless you plan on doing a lot of work, they get the **** beat out of them. (the charter boats are always the multi cabin layout 4 cabins, etc). One thing i've always noticed about the euro boats is the lack of windows. this isnt a big deal for short hauls but it can be a real bummer when you spend a lot of time on the boat. Anyhow, don't listen to me i can nitpick any boat.
I would recommend going to one of the strictly sail boat shows, looking at all the boats and get an idea for what do and do not like THEN go look at the models you narrow it down to that are 4 or 5 years old and see how they weather. Hunters look pretty nice inside when they are brand new, but they start to deteriorate the day they splash them and look like dogshit in 5 years (very poor build quallity). If you are looking for a "bluewater" cruiser or something for long range cruising I can give you a laundry list of "must haves"
Anyhow, that aside you'll get a million opinions as to what boat is best, what size is best and most them won't be anywhere near what you need or want. My first question would be what are you going to use it for? Weekend sails on nice days close to shore? Sailing around the world spending a lot of long periods on the boat? Weekends and short trips? I can definetely make some suggestions if I know what your plans are. There's a lot of production boats that I wouldn't want to wander more then a few miles offshore in due to design and build quality, however a lot of people steer clear of them thinking they will sail the world and never end up doing so.... wasting a lot of money. I could go on for days, but why bother since i dunno exactly what you are thinking.
I dunno if you are specifically looking at the elan 344 or not, I've never sailed on so i can't comment on the sailing characteristics, they are very popular in Europe and from what little i know about them they have a good build quality. A lot of them are used as charters, so don't buy an ex-charter unless you plan on doing a lot of work, they get the **** beat out of them. (the charter boats are always the multi cabin layout 4 cabins, etc). One thing i've always noticed about the euro boats is the lack of windows. this isnt a big deal for short hauls but it can be a real bummer when you spend a lot of time on the boat. Anyhow, don't listen to me i can nitpick any boat.
I would recommend going to one of the strictly sail boat shows, looking at all the boats and get an idea for what do and do not like THEN go look at the models you narrow it down to that are 4 or 5 years old and see how they weather. Hunters look pretty nice inside when they are brand new, but they start to deteriorate the day they splash them and look like dogshit in 5 years (very poor build quallity). If you are looking for a "bluewater" cruiser or something for long range cruising I can give you a laundry list of "must haves"
12-23-2007, 10:18 PM
#3
Super Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Amityville, New York
Posts: 12,288
i cant help you with the sailing stuff.
I would research where you will keep the boat and how much it will cost.
a 33' boat around here ends up costing at least $6k-$7k a year just to stay at a marina.
plus maintance.
get a survey if buying used.
I would research where you will keep the boat and how much it will cost.
a 33' boat around here ends up costing at least $6k-$7k a year just to stay at a marina.
plus maintance.
get a survey if buying used.
12-27-2007, 12:18 AM
#4
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 3,928
lookin specifically at the 344 scott..
the goal is to spend the next few years learnin how to sail.. once experience and necessary credentials are acquired.. start with short trips..
up and down the eastern seaboard.. then slowly venture out further as my confidence would allow..
lookin at anything above 30 feet and has at least enough room to shoehorn six people.. and tow an accessory..
need to find out if carryin firearms is allowed..im assumin itll vary from port to port..
the goal is to spend the next few years learnin how to sail.. once experience and necessary credentials are acquired.. start with short trips..
up and down the eastern seaboard.. then slowly venture out further as my confidence would allow..
lookin at anything above 30 feet and has at least enough room to shoehorn six people.. and tow an accessory..
need to find out if carryin firearms is allowed..im assumin itll vary from port to port..
12-27-2007, 10:53 AM
#5
Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stuart, FL
Posts: 24,416
first guns, anywhere in the us, with the exception of washington dc you are fine as long as they are legally purchased. how they are transported can vary from state to state, but aboard a boat the coast guard is really all you have to deal with and they could care less as long as they aren't pointed at them. Country to Country varies greatly. I bring my arsenal to the bahamas, all I have to do is store them in a lockable container... my cases are lockable so no worries. You also have to have an accurate account of the ammo you bring.
A 34 foot boat or similar is great for learning. It can be pretty crowded for 6 people (we live on a 46' boat very comfortably, but there's only 2 of us). That boat is well suited for coastal cruising and short runs to the bahamas, I wouldnt set off to cross the pond in her, however there are few boats that I would and even fewer "production" boats I would do a major crossing in. Of course things to consider for long trips are size, water storage or watermaker, fuel storage and storage in general (for food) these are a limiting factors in long range journeys. But I think that's a point we can skip for now. This would be my guess and this is how it usually goes, you buy a boat that's in the 30 to 36 foot range to get the hang of sailing, then a few years down the road you want something bigger with more space (u always want a bigger boat
). I honestly don't feel with limited knowledge of you what you need and what you want in a boat you can settle on the "perfect" boat the first run out, you don't really know what you need as you haven't ran accross the necessity for it.
We went from a day sailor coastal cruiser to a bluewater, liveaboard cruiser. We went from being fine with 45 gallons of water to the necessity of 250 gallons of water and a 40 gallon per hour watermaker. There were a lot more must haves in our liveaboard boat then there were in a our weekend cruiser. Without going into boring details you get my point.
Like I said before, sailing isn't rocket science, the wind blows the direction is choses and you adjust the sails accordingly... when it doesnt blow at all ya start the engine or take a nap
From what little I can tell by looking at that 344 the only suggestion I can give is get the 29 hp over the 19 hp. I would prefer the extra hp, some of the inlets down here have some unbelievable current and it's nice to have the hp to run through as apposed to waiting for a tide change. Again, I know very little about the Elan build quality, I know they are very popular in Europe. I would highly recommend going to one of the strictly sail boat shows and getting a good look at all the production boats, there's on in Miami in Feb I'll take ya sailing and go to the boat show with ya if you want to make a trip out of it LOL
About the only currently in production boat I can recommend u take a look at would be the Island Packets, they are very roomy, built like tanks and they sail fairly well (considering their pigs ) http://www.ipy.com/
A 34 foot boat or similar is great for learning. It can be pretty crowded for 6 people (we live on a 46' boat very comfortably, but there's only 2 of us). That boat is well suited for coastal cruising and short runs to the bahamas, I wouldnt set off to cross the pond in her, however there are few boats that I would and even fewer "production" boats I would do a major crossing in. Of course things to consider for long trips are size, water storage or watermaker, fuel storage and storage in general (for food) these are a limiting factors in long range journeys. But I think that's a point we can skip for now. This would be my guess and this is how it usually goes, you buy a boat that's in the 30 to 36 foot range to get the hang of sailing, then a few years down the road you want something bigger with more space (u always want a bigger boat
We went from a day sailor coastal cruiser to a bluewater, liveaboard cruiser. We went from being fine with 45 gallons of water to the necessity of 250 gallons of water and a 40 gallon per hour watermaker. There were a lot more must haves in our liveaboard boat then there were in a our weekend cruiser. Without going into boring details you get my point.
Like I said before, sailing isn't rocket science, the wind blows the direction is choses and you adjust the sails accordingly... when it doesnt blow at all ya start the engine or take a nap
From what little I can tell by looking at that 344 the only suggestion I can give is get the 29 hp over the 19 hp. I would prefer the extra hp, some of the inlets down here have some unbelievable current and it's nice to have the hp to run through as apposed to waiting for a tide change. Again, I know very little about the Elan build quality, I know they are very popular in Europe. I would highly recommend going to one of the strictly sail boat shows and getting a good look at all the production boats, there's on in Miami in Feb I'll take ya sailing and go to the boat show with ya if you want to make a trip out of it LOL
About the only currently in production boat I can recommend u take a look at would be the Island Packets, they are very roomy, built like tanks and they sail fairly well (considering their pigs
12-30-2007, 05:29 AM
#7
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: My BIG ol TURBO-DIESEL
Posts: 5,181
Originally Posted by phinsup' post='891040' date='Dec 30 2007, 01:16 AM
we just got done visiting with a guy that learned to sail on his 5,000 miles trip from sweden... now that's learning!
Vas his name Sven???
12-30-2007, 04:03 PM
#10
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 3,928
Originally Posted by phinsup' post='890877' date='Dec 27 2007, 11:53 AM
..you buy a boat that's in the 30 to 36 foot range to get the hang of sailing, then a few years down the road you want something bigger with more space...
wonderin if there are any requirements.. like crew perhaps. when you exceed a certain size..
doubt ill ever have that issue but wonderin nonetheless..