epion2985

ok let me ask another theoretic question then. From all this I am getting the idea that it is better to have the power up at the top because your are moving, so less wheel spin, so you are actually putting down(usefully) more power then if you had it at the low because then your wheels would just spin. is this right?

mazdadrifter

torque is more usefull in the higher rpms, helps pull tall gears, accelorate out of corners ect, torque at low rpms helps for towing ect,



notice the difference in the 350 in a silverado vs the 350 in the c4 corvettes?? essentially the same block, but because of it's purpose the c4 is better suited to racing, because it's torque peaks at a higher rpm.



more cases than not the rx7 is better suited for accelorating, than a similair hp v8, but the v8 jumps ahead off the line (torque at low rpm vs high)

Srce

Sort of, depends if or not you punch it. If you don't have any power down low, you'll have to wait till it builds to be competitive against another car. If you do have power down low, you don't have to use it, this way you can get rolling, not spin the wheels and then kill your opponent with the power you have available already.



The opposite. If you floor it down low with much HP, then you'll spin the tires and loose the launch because your opponent has less power and can put it down usefully (i.e. Rx7 vs. Supra where the Supra has the power down low and spins it tires, the 7 will just get pure acceleration and kill you up high).





So, it's better to have power down low since you can still outlaunch an RX7 because it has to wait to get the HP, just don't floor the throttle or the 7 will KILL YOU.



Does that make sense? I'm all over the place.



It all balances each other out.





In a perfect world with equall drivers and equall power to weight ratios. An FD would loose the launch to an MKIV Supra, but it would catch up later on and finish at the same time. That's in a perfect world though.

mazdadrifter

yes and no, due to gearing basics, as a car accelorates it encounters wind resistance ect, so you need more power to continue to acceltorate at the same rate.



if your torque peaks at a low rpm, it slowly tapers off as the rpms rise, but that is when you actually need your peak amount of torque to pull the gear, your rate of acceloration decreases as you wind out the gear



for the same reasons that a truck which can bark 3rd gear can't go over 100 mph

mazdadrifter

if it helps you any, torque is often refered to as what you FEEL.



v8 truck jumps off the line, but runs out of umph in a hurry (low low torque)



turbo rotary bogs off the line, but races past the truck as you wind the gears



jims had a good comparison, comperable hp and torque, but yet the rx7's was much more usable FOR RACING. The rx7 probably didn't feel near as strong as the mustang during normal driving.

Jims5543

I honestly think its all a matter of personal preferance. There is a Factory Five Cobra that runs at our Autocross that pulls its front inside wheel off the ground as he accelerates out of a turn its amazing to watch. He has tons of torque down low. I cannot dream of even doing that but once I am clear of the turn I can wind my 2nd gear out and not hit my rev limiter plus I am accelerating every bit as good as him if not better once I am moving and hit about 5K RPM.



So I personally think its a matter of what you want. Do you want power down low go for it.

epion2985

its pretty interesting, you guys all have incredible knowledge and yet contradic eachother:





mazdadrifter:

(torque is better at high rpms)







Srce:

(torque is good in highs and lows *sounds like you like it better at lows though*)







Jims5543:

(torque is same if not better at high rpms)







its nice to have such diverse input, not sure at times what to think of it all when it differs but all coming from credible and experienced people.

mazdadrifter

ideally you'd have the same amount of torque from 100 rpm to 7000 rpm, but that's not going to hapen, so you have to choose between the lesser evils.



Depending on your application you decide what you want your car to do. For a race car you want yoru torque up high to pull gears and acceltorate out of curves, for a towing truck you want peak torque down low, so it will have no trouble pulling heavy loads, and with your daily driver you want a happy medium.



Torque, is torque tho, 300 ft/lbs from a rotary is the same as 300ft/lbs from a v8, what we're talking about is when your recieve your peak torque in the rpm band.

epion2985

I see, I like the torque somewhat high so I think I'll stick to that. One last question, just qurious again, does the ls1 put torque down at high or low rpms? I would think it would be lows but then again it is a race/sport car...

rfreeman27

Ls1's (or most v8's for that matter) will put down more torque down low. it is just the nature of the motor. Just because it is in a sports car doesent mean much.