Lee Iacocca
03-08-2009, 10:14 PM
#22
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Amityville, New York
Posts: 12,288
max- great point.
A way to put money in my pocket is not necessarily with a check, how about tax breaks? How about no payroll taxes for a month or two?
That would free up alot of money the small business owner can use for other things.
But then it gets back into that whole needing the taxes to pay for things, so whats the solution? Let all business crash and burn? Let all home owners lose thier homes?
Not everyone has a compartment of gold coins to fall back on, we need real solutions now not bitching and telling people "I told you so"
A way to put money in my pocket is not necessarily with a check, how about tax breaks? How about no payroll taxes for a month or two?
That would free up alot of money the small business owner can use for other things.
But then it gets back into that whole needing the taxes to pay for things, so whats the solution? Let all business crash and burn? Let all home owners lose thier homes?
Not everyone has a compartment of gold coins to fall back on, we need real solutions now not bitching and telling people "I told you so"
03-08-2009, 10:37 PM
#23
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stuart, FL
Posts: 24,416
I'm giving you the solution... fiscal responsibility. Yes let homeowners lose the homes that they couldn't afford in the first place, the home value collapse and let them buy a home they can afford. None of what you are suggesting fixes anything, it just makes it worse. It is trying to fix a problem by making it bigger, it is giving a person in way over their head with massive debt a credit card to pay their minimum payments, it will not work. No where have I said "I told you so" I am suggesting the fix, you just aren't accepting it.
Yes large corporations will go broke and do you know what will happen when the large mega companies go under? Small businesses will THRIVE. I am suggesting we back out of NAFTA, we back out of the WTO and we begin making things here in the US, we begin employing americans to make the products americans use. I am suggesting that tighten up our belts, live within our means, do without fancy cars, big screen tv's, 3 cars in the driveway and a 6 bedroom house for two people.
I am suggesting smaller government, I am suggesting that rather then "get on board" with a policy of handing out money to everyone who is entitled to it and saddeling them with debt for the rest of their lives that we STOP doing that. Things will only get better when we do these things, anything else we do will make this more painful, last longer and quite possibly destroy the union we fought so hard for.
I am suggesting that rather then perpetuate the problem by demanding your share you demand the politicians live within their means. You are not suggesting a solution, you are actually suggesting that we fix a problem by doing what created the problem. If you can't pay your bills, if you can't afford to pay the payments on the debt you have, PLEASE, PLEASE explain to me how putting yourself further in debt will get you out of debt?
The current proposed solution is not new, it is Keynesian economics and it does not work, it will not work, what is being done simply amounts to rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic, if you boat is sinking you start drilling other holes and hoping the water will flow back out, you plug the hole, we are doing the very same thing we did to get to this point.
Yes large corporations will go broke and do you know what will happen when the large mega companies go under? Small businesses will THRIVE. I am suggesting we back out of NAFTA, we back out of the WTO and we begin making things here in the US, we begin employing americans to make the products americans use. I am suggesting that tighten up our belts, live within our means, do without fancy cars, big screen tv's, 3 cars in the driveway and a 6 bedroom house for two people.
I am suggesting smaller government, I am suggesting that rather then "get on board" with a policy of handing out money to everyone who is entitled to it and saddeling them with debt for the rest of their lives that we STOP doing that. Things will only get better when we do these things, anything else we do will make this more painful, last longer and quite possibly destroy the union we fought so hard for.
I am suggesting that rather then perpetuate the problem by demanding your share you demand the politicians live within their means. You are not suggesting a solution, you are actually suggesting that we fix a problem by doing what created the problem. If you can't pay your bills, if you can't afford to pay the payments on the debt you have, PLEASE, PLEASE explain to me how putting yourself further in debt will get you out of debt?
The current proposed solution is not new, it is Keynesian economics and it does not work, it will not work, what is being done simply amounts to rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic, if you boat is sinking you start drilling other holes and hoping the water will flow back out, you plug the hole, we are doing the very same thing we did to get to this point.
03-08-2009, 10:59 PM
#24
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Amityville, New York
Posts: 12,288
there are people , who I assume are smarter then you and I, who make these decisions for us. No method will yield results right away.
Im perfectly able to pay for everything around me, but when other people cant- they dont spend anymore money, or they are too scared to spend any money if they do have it. So that hurts everyone as well.
Today I can pay my bills because my customers are spending money, but when they are too scared to spend money then what happens to the businesses?
Im perfectly able to pay for everything around me, but when other people cant- they dont spend anymore money, or they are too scared to spend any money if they do have it. So that hurts everyone as well.
Today I can pay my bills because my customers are spending money, but when they are too scared to spend money then what happens to the businesses?
03-08-2009, 11:05 PM
#25
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stuart, FL
Posts: 24,416
Originally Posted by Rob x-7' post='918002' date='Mar 8 2009, 11:59 PM
there are people , who I assume are smarter then you and I, who make these decisions for us. No method will yield results right away.
Im perfectly able to pay for everything around me, but when other people cant- they dont spend anymore money, or they are too scared to spend any money if they do have it. So that hurts everyone as well.
Today I can pay my bills because my customers are spending money, but when they are too scared to spend money then what happens to the businesses?
Im perfectly able to pay for everything around me, but when other people cant- they dont spend anymore money, or they are too scared to spend any money if they do have it. So that hurts everyone as well.
Today I can pay my bills because my customers are spending money, but when they are too scared to spend money then what happens to the businesses?
WOW, you sure have a lot of faith and respect for the people who delivered us to this catastrophe in the first place. I guess you are right they are good guys a lot smarter then me, hell I didn't even see this coming so how could I possibly be able to comment on the solution? How you can hire the very same people to fix a problem they created and somehow have faith in their ability to do so is completely beyond me, but it seems to be pretty much in line with the rest of the logic being used by the tools in charge.
Since when did saving money and not buy **** become irresponsible and "hurting" other people? people weren't spending money, they were spending credit and the credit ran out, again you are suggesting by not taking on more debt to spend they are someone irresponsible and hurting america. I LOVE IT!
What about the 8+% of the people unemployed any possibility they aren't able to spend as much since they are getting half what they did before losing their job? They prolly can't get credit since they don't have a job. Useless unpatriotic ***** that they are SPEND, SPEND, take on debt, we'll figure it out!
03-08-2009, 11:11 PM
#26
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Amityville, New York
Posts: 12,288
im not saying to rack up credit card debt, im saying to spend some money. For the regular working guy his life has not changed if he does not have money in the stock market, he has the same money he had last year and the year before that, but now he is afraid to spend any of it.
Your solution is to not spend any money, just to work and not spend money, when will you start to spend some money on things other then ammo and guns?
I like all the arm chair politicians, they think they know all the answers, but all they really do is sit back and comment on everyone else's.
Why dont you become a politician and really make a change? Show them how its done.
Your solution is to not spend any money, just to work and not spend money, when will you start to spend some money on things other then ammo and guns?
I like all the arm chair politicians, they think they know all the answers, but all they really do is sit back and comment on everyone else's.
Why dont you become a politician and really make a change? Show them how its done.
03-08-2009, 11:17 PM
#27
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Calgary
Posts: 564
Backing out of Nafta will never happen. If the US did, you would most likely see a carbon tax added to the price of oil shipped south, and the value added bitumen processing would be shut down in the states, to be moved back North. Canada is currently the US's largest energy supplier.
03-08-2009, 11:32 PM
#28
Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stuart, FL
Posts: 24,416
Originally Posted by Rob x-7' post='918004' date='Mar 9 2009, 12:11 AM
im not saying to rack up credit card debt, im saying to spend some money. For the regular working guy his life has not changed if he does not have money in the stock market, he has the same money he had last year and the year before that, but now he is afraid to spend any of it.
Your solution is to not spend any money, just to work and not spend money, when will you start to spend some money on things other then ammo and guns?
I like all the arm chair politicians, they think they know all the answers, but all they really do is sit back and comment on everyone else's.
Why dont you become a politician and really make a change? Show them how its done.
Your solution is to not spend any money, just to work and not spend money, when will you start to spend some money on things other then ammo and guns?
I like all the arm chair politicians, they think they know all the answers, but all they really do is sit back and comment on everyone else's.
Why dont you become a politician and really make a change? Show them how its done.
if the working class is doing as good as they were year after year ago how come 1 in 8 homes is in foreclosure. Please enlighten me. How come 8% are without jobs? No matter how you argue it, no matter what the cause the working class IS NOT doing as well as they were 2 years ago. Blame the savers, blame me, blame the "idiots" that would rather have a good cushion in their bank in case they hit hard times, in case they become one of the unemployed for destroying the economy. and for the record a lot of working class have 401k's and retirement funds with money invested in the stock market and very large portion of that money is now gone. But don't let the facts get in the way of the things you know!
A savings is for chumps, in fact all of you people saving money are terrorists.
I'm an idiot with no grasp on the economy, what's ironic is I'm not the one asking for the handout, that must make me stupid.
Typical bullshit, if someone doesn't agree with you rather then try to understand what they are saying just use some belittling line like "I love these armchair politicians".
I also love how you are pissed at people for being rewarded for not paying their and pissed at me for not having bills.
As ******* stupid as I am I didn't lose a bunch of money in the stock market and I'm not looking for a handout on the tax payers tab, I feel like a real moron.
LOL uncle sam wasnt smart enough to keep us out of this mess, but they are smart enough to get us out of it and to suggest they are not is only proving your stupidity.
03-08-2009, 11:41 PM
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2002
Location: California
Posts: 22,465
Originally Posted by phinsup' post='917986' date='Mar 8 2009, 05:51 PM
I without a doubt guarantee you sidewinder if you hang out with other sailors and mention you have a corvette one of them will say "what the **** did you buy a sailboat for? Seems like you like to go fast you should have bought a powerboat" that and the other thing that takes some getting used to is 90% of the sailors are the cheapest ******* you will ever find, they would paint their boat pink if the paint was free, hell most of them would prolly paint it two different colors if they got two different colors for free. But they do know how to have one hell of a good time!
so when you paint the boat pink, it fixes the economy?
03-08-2009, 11:42 PM
#30
Administrator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stuart, FL
Posts: 24,416
You know what, **** it I tried and it's not worth it. It never changes no matter what the situation. 3 or 4 years ago i was insane for saying these things would happen, I was insane for calling a 6,000 Dow, it could never happen, i didn't know what I was talking about, I was an idiot "the gov't would never let that happen" I heard. Now apparently I am part of the problem, I caused it because I changed my spending habits or because I moved all of my money out of the market Months and Months before it crashed.
There's absolutely no sense in your argument, you ignore everything i say and respond with typical bullshit. You say I am not providing a solution and I suggest one, then you say I am an Armchair Politician. I'm saying "I told you so" by not suggesting a solution and as you request I provide my theory and am therefor an Armchair politician. Gee how do I win that "argument", I can't. Typical gov't spew, you are either with us or against. If you critisize the regime you are an idiot as no one could be as smart as a harvard educated lawyer. lawyers are the cream of the crop. I can't win, by your logic anything a politician says should not be questions because they are smarter then everyone else and if you do question them you are some know it all armchair politician. The fact remains, I was smart enough to see this coming (even if I'm not as smart as the ones who delivered us to this evil), I made money when others lost it and reduced my spending, i moved my money and I am not begging for a handout from from uncle sam.
I give up, I hope you get exactly what you are asking for Rob, in fact I am reasonably certain that you will, but I'm not going to "Armchair Politician" it and comment on the legislation in the pipeline.
There's absolutely no sense in your argument, you ignore everything i say and respond with typical bullshit. You say I am not providing a solution and I suggest one, then you say I am an Armchair Politician. I'm saying "I told you so" by not suggesting a solution and as you request I provide my theory and am therefor an Armchair politician. Gee how do I win that "argument", I can't. Typical gov't spew, you are either with us or against. If you critisize the regime you are an idiot as no one could be as smart as a harvard educated lawyer. lawyers are the cream of the crop. I can't win, by your logic anything a politician says should not be questions because they are smarter then everyone else and if you do question them you are some know it all armchair politician. The fact remains, I was smart enough to see this coming (even if I'm not as smart as the ones who delivered us to this evil), I made money when others lost it and reduced my spending, i moved my money and I am not begging for a handout from from uncle sam.
I give up, I hope you get exactly what you are asking for Rob, in fact I am reasonably certain that you will, but I'm not going to "Armchair Politician" it and comment on the legislation in the pipeline.