Megasquirt Ecu
08-10-2005, 04:38 PM
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 162
[quote name='jefraney' date='Aug 10 2005, 07:33 AM']So you still use the stock CAS? I am really considering this now.
What, if anything, do you need for the rotary engine?
[/quote]
Either the FD CAS or the second gen CAS can be used. With the 2nd gen (12+1) configuration you need a few extra bits of circuitry, either on proto board or small runs of a daughterboard have been done by a few people.
Search on www.msefi.com. Things are really hotting up there on the rotary front at the moment as a rotary owning programmer has got on board and taken over from the feeble efforts of us hackers.
What, if anything, do you need for the rotary engine?
[snapback]747082[/snapback]
[/quote]
Either the FD CAS or the second gen CAS can be used. With the 2nd gen (12+1) configuration you need a few extra bits of circuitry, either on proto board or small runs of a daughterboard have been done by a few people.
Search on www.msefi.com. Things are really hotting up there on the rotary front at the moment as a rotary owning programmer has got on board and taken over from the feeble efforts of us hackers.
08-11-2005, 03:40 AM
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii USA
Posts: 925
[quote name='bill shurvinton' date='Aug 8 2005, 02:16 PM']But with the haltech you do not have access to the source code to add you own function. That's the real joy. When a problem is found the code can be changed to meet the challenge. And as there are code monkeys with no spanner skills and spanner monkeys with no code skills (and a few with both skills) the mutual bartering that takes place brings people together and makes friends in a way no Haltech can.
[/quote]
Sorry, but in my position, I cannot wait will MS establishes itself to be a "force to be reckoned with".
I have customers I support, and to give them an excuse like "wait till the code is rewritten to solve that problem" just doesn't cut it.
I don't have to time to buy "kits" and build them myself.
I don't have time to take care of it myself, as I'm working 16 hours a day - 80 hours weeks.
I like to support a company a believe in and builds good products with support.
This is what Haltech offers me at this point in time.
MS offers a very economical option, but don't kid yourself - it is not a direct competitor to Haltech / Microtech / Autronic / MoTeC...yet.
-Ted
http://fc3spro.com/
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[/quote]
Sorry, but in my position, I cannot wait will MS establishes itself to be a "force to be reckoned with".
I have customers I support, and to give them an excuse like "wait till the code is rewritten to solve that problem" just doesn't cut it.
I don't have to time to buy "kits" and build them myself.
I don't have time to take care of it myself, as I'm working 16 hours a day - 80 hours weeks.
I like to support a company a believe in and builds good products with support.
This is what Haltech offers me at this point in time.
MS offers a very economical option, but don't kid yourself - it is not a direct competitor to Haltech / Microtech / Autronic / MoTeC...yet.
-Ted
http://fc3spro.com/
08-11-2005, 11:41 AM
#24
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 162
[quote name='RETed' date='Aug 11 2005, 12:40 AM']Sorry, but in my position, I cannot wait will MS establishes itself to be a "force to be reckoned with".
I have customers I support, and to give them an excuse like "wait till the code is rewritten to solve that problem" just doesn't cut it.
I don't have to time to buy "kits" and build them myself.
I don't have time to take care of it myself, as I'm working 16 hours a day - 80 hours weeks.
I like to support a company a believe in and builds good products with support.
This is what Haltech offers me at this point in time.
MS offers a very economical option, but don't kid yourself - it is not a direct competitor to Haltech / Microtech / Autronic / MoTeC...yet.
-Ted
http://fc3spro.com/
[/quote]
But once again you are completely missing the point. You are after a unit to sell to customers. This thread is about whether MS is a good unit to learn about EFI on; the answer to which is an emphatic yes. It is a DIY project to help people learn and to develop the sort of EFI systems people want for their projects. You are expected to put some effort in. It is not intended as a competitor to units that cost 5 times as much, even though it may offer more functionality before too long.
Looking on the Haltech forums there seems to be as much waiting for new code as with any other ECU, so other than an 8 year head start on the codebase I'm not sure that is even a valid argument.
With the 13B MS is very close to the critical mass of installs where it really blossoms, but is for people who work on their cars, not people who go cheque book racing and just pay a speed shop to do it all.
I have customers I support, and to give them an excuse like "wait till the code is rewritten to solve that problem" just doesn't cut it.
I don't have to time to buy "kits" and build them myself.
I don't have time to take care of it myself, as I'm working 16 hours a day - 80 hours weeks.
I like to support a company a believe in and builds good products with support.
This is what Haltech offers me at this point in time.
MS offers a very economical option, but don't kid yourself - it is not a direct competitor to Haltech / Microtech / Autronic / MoTeC...yet.
-Ted
http://fc3spro.com/
[snapback]747467[/snapback]
[/quote]
But once again you are completely missing the point. You are after a unit to sell to customers. This thread is about whether MS is a good unit to learn about EFI on; the answer to which is an emphatic yes. It is a DIY project to help people learn and to develop the sort of EFI systems people want for their projects. You are expected to put some effort in. It is not intended as a competitor to units that cost 5 times as much, even though it may offer more functionality before too long.
Looking on the Haltech forums there seems to be as much waiting for new code as with any other ECU, so other than an 8 year head start on the codebase I'm not sure that is even a valid argument.
With the 13B MS is very close to the critical mass of installs where it really blossoms, but is for people who work on their cars, not people who go cheque book racing and just pay a speed shop to do it all.
08-11-2005, 05:32 PM
#25
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,502
I'm with Bill on his logic
FYI, renns has been tinkering with a stock CAS to run ignition, and he has code in his MS controller that runs the spark advance/retard, and has full control over. You can use ANY signal to modify the timing and fuel delivery, all you have to do is add lines of code..
Sure, the MS doesn't work for YOU, Ted, because you don't have the skills that the MS community requires to effectively utilize the unit..
I guess the only way you will consider it a force to be reckoned with is when either a spanner monkey or a code monkey blows you out of the water with the exponential flexability of the MS unit over ANY haltec unit
You can wait for haltec to develop code for you to do cool ****, or you can get your hands dirty with an MS and make it happen yourself, and at the same time, you're writing the code for YOUR specific application, and you don't have to stick within the boundaries of the code developed for the mass public via haltec
FYI, renns has been tinkering with a stock CAS to run ignition, and he has code in his MS controller that runs the spark advance/retard, and has full control over. You can use ANY signal to modify the timing and fuel delivery, all you have to do is add lines of code..
Sure, the MS doesn't work for YOU, Ted, because you don't have the skills that the MS community requires to effectively utilize the unit..
I guess the only way you will consider it a force to be reckoned with is when either a spanner monkey or a code monkey blows you out of the water with the exponential flexability of the MS unit over ANY haltec unit
You can wait for haltec to develop code for you to do cool ****, or you can get your hands dirty with an MS and make it happen yourself, and at the same time, you're writing the code for YOUR specific application, and you don't have to stick within the boundaries of the code developed for the mass public via haltec
08-11-2005, 10:23 PM
#26
Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 40
Originally Posted by ColinRX7' date='Aug 11 2005, 02:32 PM
FYI, renns has been tinkering with a stock CAS to run ignition, and he has code in his MS controller that runs the spark advance/retard, and has full control over. You can use ANY signal to modify the timing and fuel delivery, all you have to do is add lines of code..
Just to clarify, I haven't been doing any of the code work. My bench-testing has only been to offer feedback to James, and recently Ken, as they are the ones doing the programming. The results of this testing, and the related development work is all nicely documented in the rotary ignition thread over on msefi.com, now up to 12 pages long...
http://www.msefi.com/viewtopic.php?t=7544
It is ready for in-vehicle testing now. I'd run it myself, but my EDIS-based ignition has been trouble-free so I'll leave that work to someone else. Colin, if you could keep an engine together long enough, we could set it up in your car ;-).
Roger.
08-12-2005, 12:22 AM
#27
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii USA
Posts: 925
[quote name='ColinRX7' date='Aug 11 2005, 02:32 PM']Sure, the MS doesn't work for YOU, Ted, because you don't have the skills that the MS community requires to effectively utilize the unit..[/quote]
WTF is your problem?
This is a flat-out insult if I ever saw one - I thought that **** wasn't supposed to happen on here anymore?
You don't know anything about me.
I'm an "amatuer" EE, and I got into my 3rd year of CS, even passing my assembly course no problem.
I don't have the skills?
Oh puhlease...
I think you're overestimating the potential of the MS.
Right now, unless there's a way to expand the map size, it's way too small.
All I want the ECU to do is competently handle fuel and ignition.
Haltech does have it's disadvantages (no load and RPM staging), but it's still workable.
God, you sound those LINUX prophets who keep claiming LINUX is going to take over the world...
Sure, I would love to get dirty with the code to make all the things I want fixed, but - see below - I don't have the time.
I guess you didn't understand my point.
I don't have the time to hack away at this ****.
-Ted
http://fc3spro.com/
WTF is your problem?
This is a flat-out insult if I ever saw one - I thought that **** wasn't supposed to happen on here anymore?
You don't know anything about me.
I'm an "amatuer" EE, and I got into my 3rd year of CS, even passing my assembly course no problem.
I don't have the skills?
Oh puhlease...
I guess the only way you will consider it a force to be reckoned with is when either a spanner monkey or a code monkey blows you out of the water with the exponential flexability of the MS unit over ANY haltec unit
Right now, unless there's a way to expand the map size, it's way too small.
All I want the ECU to do is competently handle fuel and ignition.
Haltech does have it's disadvantages (no load and RPM staging), but it's still workable.
God, you sound those LINUX prophets who keep claiming LINUX is going to take over the world...
Sure, I would love to get dirty with the code to make all the things I want fixed, but - see below - I don't have the time.
You can wait for haltec to develop code for you to do cool ****, or you can get your hands dirty with an MS and make it happen yourself, and at the same time, you're writing the code for YOUR specific application, and you don't have to stick within the boundaries of the code developed for the mass public via haltec
[snapback]747703[/snapback]
I don't have the time to hack away at this ****.
-Ted
http://fc3spro.com/
08-12-2005, 06:36 PM
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,502
Excuse my wording.. I meant time to apply the skills you have.. Reread my statement with TIME TO APPLY and it should make more sense... My appologies
Everybody has different levels of skill, I have to keep speaking with renns everytime I have a problem.. You don't have time to apply any level of skill considering theres no customer support, its just open source.. You can't afford any risks, right? I wasn't trying to insult you.. If I was, I wouldn't hide behind indirect comments, I'd just tell you that I think you're an idiot.. See how easy it was? Relax Ted..
I understood your standpoint completely, but just because it's not within your scope of application doesn't mean it doesn't deserve any credit
Everybody has different levels of skill, I have to keep speaking with renns everytime I have a problem.. You don't have time to apply any level of skill considering theres no customer support, its just open source.. You can't afford any risks, right? I wasn't trying to insult you.. If I was, I wouldn't hide behind indirect comments, I'd just tell you that I think you're an idiot.. See how easy it was? Relax Ted..
I understood your standpoint completely, but just because it's not within your scope of application doesn't mean it doesn't deserve any credit
08-13-2005, 02:46 AM
#30
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii USA
Posts: 925
As of this moment, the MS is not in the same category as the Microtech / Haltech / Autronic.
I dunno why people like to compare them like apples-to-apples. :P
What we need is someone to start offering MS kits for the RX-7's and see what the pricing comes out to be???
Some eBay seller is selling them for other cars, and they are asking $500 for it!
I think the price is going to push closer to $1,000 once you get everything squared away...
Right now, it's all talk.
I understand your point about having it open-source and the capabilites are limitless, but the fact of the matter is...there is no such thing, especially with electronics.
You might think you can add a bazillion things to it, but there comes a point where the uP gets too loaded to handle all that processing...unless you go faster uP, which means more money.
I'm NOT knocking the MS - get that straight.
I'm just waiting on the sidelines to see if MS can develop into something what all of you guys are bragging about.
There are very few people that are doing the "grunt work in the trenches"; I've done that kinda stuff before, and it's tedious and boring.
Is there anyone that's contributing to the open-source development of the MS for 13B applications on here???
-Ted
http://fc3spro.com/
I dunno why people like to compare them like apples-to-apples. :P
What we need is someone to start offering MS kits for the RX-7's and see what the pricing comes out to be???
Some eBay seller is selling them for other cars, and they are asking $500 for it!
I think the price is going to push closer to $1,000 once you get everything squared away...
Right now, it's all talk.
I understand your point about having it open-source and the capabilites are limitless, but the fact of the matter is...there is no such thing, especially with electronics.
You might think you can add a bazillion things to it, but there comes a point where the uP gets too loaded to handle all that processing...unless you go faster uP, which means more money.
I'm NOT knocking the MS - get that straight.
I'm just waiting on the sidelines to see if MS can develop into something what all of you guys are bragging about.
There are very few people that are doing the "grunt work in the trenches"; I've done that kinda stuff before, and it's tedious and boring.
Is there anyone that's contributing to the open-source development of the MS for 13B applications on here???
-Ted
http://fc3spro.com/