Low Water Temp With Pfc?
11-03-2003, 11:32 PM
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 14
Well, I am finally narrowing my search for my perfect FD.
The car has a Street Ported motor with 9,000 miles (17psi at vaccum) and here is what he wrote regarding the boost levels:
See, I'm from the world of Honda, and not familiar at all with the PFC. I assume it would come with some sort of base map, with a richer tune. Now, I don't really know how a street port would effect this.
He is saying that due to the fact the PFC hasn't been tuned it is reading low water temp, and it thinks the car isn't warm yet. Consequently it is only boosting at 6psi. Is this something that can be fixed with a dyno tuning session? I plan on having the car dyno tuned right after I pick it up. Could this be a problem with the motor itself?
TIA again!
-Will Chmelar
The car has a Street Ported motor with 9,000 miles (17psi at vaccum) and here is what he wrote regarding the boost levels:
One thing I have to tell you
though, is that on the power FC it is reading low water temps, so it does
not allow it to boost up to 10 psi (only up to about 6psi.), because it
thinks the car hasn't warmed up yet. Once in a while, on a hot day, it does
heat up just enough to kick in, and it really hauls ***. It is pretty quick
as it is though. Can be, because I haven't gotten the computer re-tuned
since the street port. XS-engineering says I should be seeing about 350-375
HP once tuned on the dyno.
though, is that on the power FC it is reading low water temps, so it does
not allow it to boost up to 10 psi (only up to about 6psi.), because it
thinks the car hasn't warmed up yet. Once in a while, on a hot day, it does
heat up just enough to kick in, and it really hauls ***. It is pretty quick
as it is though. Can be, because I haven't gotten the computer re-tuned
since the street port. XS-engineering says I should be seeing about 350-375
HP once tuned on the dyno.
See, I'm from the world of Honda, and not familiar at all with the PFC. I assume it would come with some sort of base map, with a richer tune. Now, I don't really know how a street port would effect this.
He is saying that due to the fact the PFC hasn't been tuned it is reading low water temp, and it thinks the car isn't warm yet. Consequently it is only boosting at 6psi. Is this something that can be fixed with a dyno tuning session? I plan on having the car dyno tuned right after I pick it up. Could this be a problem with the motor itself?
TIA again!
-Will Chmelar
11-04-2003, 03:46 AM
#3
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Wi nøt trei a høliday in Sweden this yër?
Posts: 1,113
Originally Posted by jspecracer7' date='Nov 4 2003, 03:21 AM
What this guy is saying makes no sense(not the poster, but the seller) 
AFAIK, water temp shouldn't affect the spool-up.
have you had a chance to test-drive the car?
AFAIK, water temp shouldn't affect the spool-up.
have you had a chance to test-drive the car?
AFAIK, water temp shouldn't affect the spool-up of the turbos
11-04-2003, 03:55 AM
#4
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Okinawa, Japan
Posts: 4,928
I think the only things that water temp affects is how much percentage of fuel at warm up(water temp correction) ands ignition vs water temp(higher water temp I believe retards timing) but it should NOT affect boost.
Now that I think about it...the stock ecu has a warm up value that won't allow you to boost until your at a certain water temp, but I KNOW that the PFC doesn't have it built in.
Either way, it is NOT a motor problem. Proly more along the lines of a tuning error/electrical problem.
Now that I think about it...the stock ecu has a warm up value that won't allow you to boost until your at a certain water temp, but I KNOW that the PFC doesn't have it built in.
Either way, it is NOT a motor problem. Proly more along the lines of a tuning error/electrical problem.
11-04-2003, 04:37 AM
#6
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Wi nøt trei a høliday in Sweden this yër?
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you should look around on the regional forums here, see if someone who has a 3rd gen could test drive it for you. if this guy has a PFC commander, they could note what the ecu is reading for water temp.
what dragon said-
i don't think it should be a tuning problem, with the seller saying 'with a dyno tune it should see XXX horsepower'. maybe an electrical problem though. the only electrical problem i've heard of with 3rd gens is bad engine grounds, and i've experienced them myself. they went away when i installed my PFC, and that's the common cure for this too.
for the smart guys:
could it be a boost leak? if this guy is seeing a full 10lbs. on a hot day, it [I/]shouldn't[I] be a boost leak, ambient temp shouldn't effect the bost pattern, right? if he is seeing the stock pattern on a hot day, he most likely would be seeing higher than stock on a cold day right? i've seen higher than stock boost on a cold day, along with my buddy FudD.
what dragon said-
i don't think it should be a tuning problem, with the seller saying 'with a dyno tune it should see XXX horsepower'. maybe an electrical problem though. the only electrical problem i've heard of with 3rd gens is bad engine grounds, and i've experienced them myself. they went away when i installed my PFC, and that's the common cure for this too.
for the smart guys:
could it be a boost leak? if this guy is seeing a full 10lbs. on a hot day, it [I/]shouldn't[I] be a boost leak, ambient temp shouldn't effect the bost pattern, right? if he is seeing the stock pattern on a hot day, he most likely would be seeing higher than stock on a cold day right? i've seen higher than stock boost on a cold day, along with my buddy FudD.
11-04-2003, 04:50 AM
#7
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 14
Originally Posted by JimmyJimboJet' date='Nov 4 2003, 02:37 AM
you should look around on the regional forums here, see if someone who has a 3rd gen could test drive it for you. if this guy has a PFC commander, they could note what the ecu is reading for water temp.
what dragon said-
i don't think it should be a tuning problem, with the seller saying 'with a dyno tune it should see XXX horsepower'. maybe an electrical problem though. the only electrical problem i've heard of with 3rd gens is bad engine grounds, and i've experienced them myself. they went away when i installed my PFC, and that's the common cure for this too.
for the smart guys:
could it be a boost leak? if this guy is seeing a full 10lbs. on a hot day, it [I/]shouldn't[I] be a boost leak, ambient temp shouldn't effect the bost pattern, right? if he is seeing the stock pattern on a hot day, he most likely would be seeing higher than stock on a cold day right? i've seen higher than stock boost on a cold day, along with my buddy FudD.
what dragon said-
i don't think it should be a tuning problem, with the seller saying 'with a dyno tune it should see XXX horsepower'. maybe an electrical problem though. the only electrical problem i've heard of with 3rd gens is bad engine grounds, and i've experienced them myself. they went away when i installed my PFC, and that's the common cure for this too.
for the smart guys:
could it be a boost leak? if this guy is seeing a full 10lbs. on a hot day, it [I/]shouldn't[I] be a boost leak, ambient temp shouldn't effect the bost pattern, right? if he is seeing the stock pattern on a hot day, he most likely would be seeing higher than stock on a cold day right? i've seen higher than stock boost on a cold day, along with my buddy FudD.
I guess he is in / right outside of LA, so hopefully I can find someone.
What you were saying about the boost is the opposite that is happening to him.
The boost shouldn't really matter regardless of temperature, right? Wouldn't the wastegate regulate the amount of boost seen at the IM regardless of ambient temp? I understand the car may run better due to the dense air, but I don't know about the boost pattern.... I have no clue though, just a guess.
He is saying, the water temp reads higher on the hot days, and based on the higher water temperature, the car will see more boost. I have no idea why that makes sense. I guess I just thought if the water temp was under a certain temp, the PFC wouldn't allow full boost (as a safety precaution). That was just a guess. I was thinking more along the lines of a problem with the temp sensor, or thermostat.
Then again, I don't know.
Thanks for the help guys!
11-04-2003, 05:29 AM
#8
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Wi nøt trei a høliday in Sweden this yër?
Posts: 1,113
The boost shouldn't really matter regardless of temperature, right? Wouldn't the wastegate regulate the amount of boost seen at the IM regardless of ambient temp? I understand the car may run better due to the dense air, but I don't know about the boost pattern....
yes, you are correct. the ambient should not have any effect on the boost or boost patter. the car will just 'get there quicker' if that makes any sense. i noticed minor spikes after i installed my dp last winter, and my buddy also has a third gen with dp, intake and exhaust, he's noticed a huge amount of response with the turbos when it's pretty cool outside.
i read thru it some more, and i can see how the ecu wouldn't allow the full boost if the engine is at normal operating temps. but for him to say 'it hauls ***' on a hot day just sounds wierd to me, especially if XS says it should be pushing more than 100 whp over stock with a tune. i can see why your concerned.
any car pushing 100+ whp over stock should be hauling ***, whether with a professional dyno tune or running a relatively rich PFC base map (FD's in particular)
you never listed all the mods on this car either. that would really help too.
i'm sure you could find someone on here who could drive the car for you to check it out (i'm assuming by now that it's not a local car for you).
TwinTurboTeddy or j9fd3s are a few guys that i would look into. i'm sure they would gladly check out the car for you
otherwise check out the other forum (rx7club.com)
jimmy