Help: after clutch job, car now has vibration
07-17-2002, 06:26 PM
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 2,467
turbovr6 has good suggestions. Sorry about the shitty luck, those god damn rookie mechanics, there are so many of them and so few bullets.
I only let Rob @ Pineapple work on my sev-e, if i can't do it myself. clutch jobs are easy, with the right tools and a little practice you can do one in your sleep. I would absolutly chew the first shop out, find a more RX-7 specific shop, and shove the bill from the second shop directly up the first shop's ***, this kind of **** really pisses me off.
Good luck,
James
I only let Rob @ Pineapple work on my sev-e, if i can't do it myself. clutch jobs are easy, with the right tools and a little practice you can do one in your sleep. I would absolutly chew the first shop out, find a more RX-7 specific shop, and shove the bill from the second shop directly up the first shop's ***, this kind of **** really pisses me off.
Good luck,
James
07-18-2002, 08:53 AM
#12
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 12
Turbor6 suggestion makes a lot of sense. I got hold of experienced rx-7 guy to go to the garage and take a look. I do not believe these guys used a engine support which the service manual calls for. I actually started to read into the service manual when this happened. Right now, I just want to take the car out of that garage and then once I fix the problem, I will be taking them to the small claims court if they do not refund my money. Will post result on the problem found. I am mad as hell. They actually try to make it sound like I had this problem before. I am in the midst of documenting events. If anyone knows of a good rx-7 garage in Ottawa, Ontario, Canada, let me know. I spoke to the Mazda dealer in Ottawa, they also sounds pretty scary.
07-18-2002, 02:24 PM
#13
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 12
Latest saga on this problem. The experienced RX-7 guy and I went to the garage and check out the car. This guy used to work as a RX-7 mechanic but not anymore. Immediately, he indicated that this is not an Engine problem but a driveline type of vibration. The Garage owner argued with him and still believe the problem is in the engine. The Garage owner basically want to wash his hands on this car now. Found out that the Clutch part he used is from Ottawa Clutch and is not a Mazda part. According to the Garage owner he did thousands of Clutch job before and even his own Farari with Ottawa Clutch. He claims the Clutch are not re-builds, they are new. He also said that the flywheel counter weight is not removable and the my RX-7 guy believe that is the case also. I took the car to a local Mazda dealer just to see what they can do. My new found RX-7 guy is no longer in the mechanic business and do not have access to hoist. The local Mazda dealer service manager took one look and stated that either the Flywheel is not true or the clutch/pressure plate(?) assembly is not centered properly to the flywheel. He also believe the vibration is not from the engine. He stated that even if one rotor blade not working it would not have this much vibration. He was supprised that the Garage is trying to wash his hand on this problem. I went back to the original garage and want them to be reponsible in fixing this. I told them if they do not, I will take legal action. The owner of the Garage is not there, so I told the Mechanic (did I say Mechanic?) that they are responsible, and if they do not, I will take legal action. It is now my strong believe that the problem is in the flywheel or the clutch unit they put in. So, my question to the experts out there is that:
1) Should I get them to put in a new flywheel or can the old flywheel be checked for balance and true. This was the original stock unit but was resurfaced by Ottawa Clutch.
2) Should I get them to put in a new Mazda stock Clutch?
3) Is there a bearing somewhere that could cause this type of problem if it does not meet spec?
4) Any other suggestions?
I am now fighting mad!
1) Should I get them to put in a new flywheel or can the old flywheel be checked for balance and true. This was the original stock unit but was resurfaced by Ottawa Clutch.
2) Should I get them to put in a new Mazda stock Clutch?
3) Is there a bearing somewhere that could cause this type of problem if it does not meet spec?
4) Any other suggestions?
I am now fighting mad!
07-18-2002, 02:38 PM
#14
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: NJ
Posts: 4,981
Ok ready.... in order
1. if you send a flywheel to be machined they shave off like .008 mm from the surface to give the new clutch disk a nice smooth even surface to mate with. The only way this could effect balance if if the flywheel was not mounted to the lathe correctly. There is a tolerance level of the minimum thickness the surface of the flywheel can be. So it's your choice to either get a new one or have them send that one out again to be checked.balanced,resurfaced.
2. Many aftermarket clucthes are good, some are ****, unfortunatly I've never heard of your company they used. Personally, I would put a mazda clutch set in, unless the price differance was tremendous and you can't afford it.
3. The pilot bearing is the only bearing that comes into play when you talk vibration. I've never heard of one causing a vibration, horrible noises yes, vibration, no.
4. final thoughts....
Now that you have it narrowed down to a drivetrain vibration, you know either they screwed up your flywheel, the parts they put in were defective, or the parts were put in wrong.
Fight Fight Fight, If they refuse to do it, have the dealer do it, have them document their findings, and then sue the pants off the idiots at that shop!
1. if you send a flywheel to be machined they shave off like .008 mm from the surface to give the new clutch disk a nice smooth even surface to mate with. The only way this could effect balance if if the flywheel was not mounted to the lathe correctly. There is a tolerance level of the minimum thickness the surface of the flywheel can be. So it's your choice to either get a new one or have them send that one out again to be checked.balanced,resurfaced.
2. Many aftermarket clucthes are good, some are ****, unfortunatly I've never heard of your company they used. Personally, I would put a mazda clutch set in, unless the price differance was tremendous and you can't afford it.
3. The pilot bearing is the only bearing that comes into play when you talk vibration. I've never heard of one causing a vibration, horrible noises yes, vibration, no.
4. final thoughts....
Now that you have it narrowed down to a drivetrain vibration, you know either they screwed up your flywheel, the parts they put in were defective, or the parts were put in wrong.
Fight Fight Fight, If they refuse to do it, have the dealer do it, have them document their findings, and then sue the pants off the idiots at that shop!
07-18-2002, 03:39 PM
#15
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 12
Local dealer now would not touch this since they does not want to be involved. So, After I cool down a bit (still planning legal action) and thinking through this, I am left with the following choices:
1) Get the local deal to do the job, pay for it. Best case senario -it solves the problem (most likely), sue the pants of the other Garage. Worst case senario: it still vibrates then I am hosted - the dealer say they would not garantee the work since they may not be able to solve what the other garage did.
2) Get the original Garage to either resurfing the flywheel again or change flywheel (preferably the way to go here - I probably need to pay for the delta) , put in Mazda part. Best case senario - works and I am happy. Never go back to the shop again. Report them to better business bureau. Bad part about this is that I do not trust these jokers. Worst case senario - still not fixed. Garage is then probably wash their hands on the problem.
3) Make the shope responsible. Get them to solve this. Probability of this works out is not good. They are not familiar with the RX-7 environment and can go completely of some tangent.
4) Get them to change the clutch and resurfing the flywheel from Ottawa Clutch. I do not like this since I do not know how good or shitty their stuff is. It may be that their part is just not right.
5) Walk away and re-do the job myself. I have done clutch job years ago. But do not have access to hoist. Sue the bastards. Probably not a good idea. The Garage would just wash their hands, and said something I did solved the problem and it was not their fault. If I go this way, probably go with racing aftermarket parts.
I think option #2 is probably the way to go even though I do not trust them but dealer is probably not much better. My take on this is that the Garage is a bolting in mechanical component type of shop and the problem is in Ottawa Clutch. They probably has no way to check the balance. Taking the clutch assembly apart again is not going to find the problem. Most likely the problem will be solved by using new flywheel/mazda clutch part.
- Question to the forum gurus - is there any possible way to install the clutch/pressure plate assembly off centered? Is their any adjustment on installation they have to do. From what I remembered from years ago, this was not possible, also from what I remembered from reading the manual is that it is not. Everything should be keyed. Is the above correct?
Still fighting mad.. just cool down sufficiently to think.
1) Get the local deal to do the job, pay for it. Best case senario -it solves the problem (most likely), sue the pants of the other Garage. Worst case senario: it still vibrates then I am hosted - the dealer say they would not garantee the work since they may not be able to solve what the other garage did.
2) Get the original Garage to either resurfing the flywheel again or change flywheel (preferably the way to go here - I probably need to pay for the delta) , put in Mazda part. Best case senario - works and I am happy. Never go back to the shop again. Report them to better business bureau. Bad part about this is that I do not trust these jokers. Worst case senario - still not fixed. Garage is then probably wash their hands on the problem.
3) Make the shope responsible. Get them to solve this. Probability of this works out is not good. They are not familiar with the RX-7 environment and can go completely of some tangent.
4) Get them to change the clutch and resurfing the flywheel from Ottawa Clutch. I do not like this since I do not know how good or shitty their stuff is. It may be that their part is just not right.
5) Walk away and re-do the job myself. I have done clutch job years ago. But do not have access to hoist. Sue the bastards. Probably not a good idea. The Garage would just wash their hands, and said something I did solved the problem and it was not their fault. If I go this way, probably go with racing aftermarket parts.
I think option #2 is probably the way to go even though I do not trust them but dealer is probably not much better. My take on this is that the Garage is a bolting in mechanical component type of shop and the problem is in Ottawa Clutch. They probably has no way to check the balance. Taking the clutch assembly apart again is not going to find the problem. Most likely the problem will be solved by using new flywheel/mazda clutch part.
- Question to the forum gurus - is there any possible way to install the clutch/pressure plate assembly off centered? Is their any adjustment on installation they have to do. From what I remembered from years ago, this was not possible, also from what I remembered from reading the manual is that it is not. Everything should be keyed. Is the above correct?
Still fighting mad.. just cool down sufficiently to think.
07-18-2002, 03:57 PM
#17
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: NJ
Posts: 4,981
yeah everything goes one way. you could have something off center if you are a butcher and just plow the screws in with an impact drive 
Most likly defective parts, or a bad job on the flywheel/
I still say have it dne somewhere else with mazda parts then sue.
you can do it on the ground. need a jack, jackstands, and a strong bar to go across to each fender with a chain to hold up the motor, or you could prop up the motor with some wood blocks or a secod jack
Most likly defective parts, or a bad job on the flywheel/
I still say have it dne somewhere else with mazda parts then sue.
you can do it on the ground. need a jack, jackstands, and a strong bar to go across to each fender with a chain to hold up the motor, or you could prop up the motor with some wood blocks or a secod jack
07-19-2002, 12:54 PM
#18
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 12
I threaten to sue in writting. Do not want to spend money on a new flywheel yet just to prove they screw it up. They are now agreeing the prolem most likely is between flywheel and bad part. They are now going to to check the vibration with the flywheel but without the clutch assembly to isolate the problem area down (I had to tell them that, duh...). If the flywheel is off balanced, then they will send it back to Ottawa Clutch to recheck balance. If the problem is trace down to not the flywheel but bad clutch assembly, I will then ask them to change to Mazda part. At least now they are now know that I am not taking this laying down and serious about taking legal action. Will keep forum updated. Thanks to all who has offer their input and help.
