Marvel Mystery Oil
12-22-2003, 07:30 PM
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,284
It seems the ATF and MMO are nearly identical in their carbon softening ability. I was able to chip all the way through the carbon on the spring side of both apex seals with my thumbnail, all the way down to the metal. It took similar amounts of effort on both.
Then again, the carbon could have come off just as easily before the seals were soaked. I'm going to check out the remaining two (unsoaked) 13B seals in a few minutes.
In my opinion, ATF may be substituted for MMO for soaking parts to try to soften carbon, but it may not be necessary at all. I've personally never needed to soak carbonized parts to try to loosen carbon before, and probably never will. I see no need to.
Then again, the carbon could have come off just as easily before the seals were soaked. I'm going to check out the remaining two (unsoaked) 13B seals in a few minutes.
In my opinion, ATF may be substituted for MMO for soaking parts to try to soften carbon, but it may not be necessary at all. I've personally never needed to soak carbonized parts to try to loosen carbon before, and probably never will. I see no need to.
12-22-2003, 08:14 PM
#22
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,284
The other 13B apex seals were actually already clean. I must have already ran a razorblade across the spring side. The 12A apex seals had a hefty amount of carbon on them though, and I was still able to cut into it with a fingernail. A razorblade would work ten times better. Besides, dry apex seals let the carbon chip off without sticking to it.
My conclusion is that soaking parts in ATF and MMO is unnecessary. If you need to pour something into your engine to try to unstick an apex or side seal, MMO is best because it is thin enough to get into tight spaces, and has some solvent action. If your engine is carbon locked, MMO will most likely save you from having to tear it down. If your engine doesn't like to start because of a slow starter, Castrol GTX poured into the intake in a small quantity will work wonders. If your engine is flooded, simply pull the plugs, dry them, maybe crank the engine with the fuel pump disconnected to blow all the excess gas out of the plug holes, reinstall the plugs and try again.
No need for ATF at all.
Oh, and another thing. To get carbon off of rotors, I've gotten great results from soaking the rotors in gas to eliminate the oil film. Then I let them fully dry (for obvious reasons). Then I wirewheel all the carbon off of the rotor faces. It works great because the carbon gets whisked away without redepositing itself onto the rotors. The apex and side seal slots, as well as the heat dams, can be cleaned with small scrapers or the seals themselves (the heat dams aren't that hard to clean with a walnut or dental tool).
My conclusion is that soaking parts in ATF and MMO is unnecessary. If you need to pour something into your engine to try to unstick an apex or side seal, MMO is best because it is thin enough to get into tight spaces, and has some solvent action. If your engine is carbon locked, MMO will most likely save you from having to tear it down. If your engine doesn't like to start because of a slow starter, Castrol GTX poured into the intake in a small quantity will work wonders. If your engine is flooded, simply pull the plugs, dry them, maybe crank the engine with the fuel pump disconnected to blow all the excess gas out of the plug holes, reinstall the plugs and try again.
No need for ATF at all.
Oh, and another thing. To get carbon off of rotors, I've gotten great results from soaking the rotors in gas to eliminate the oil film. Then I let them fully dry (for obvious reasons). Then I wirewheel all the carbon off of the rotor faces. It works great because the carbon gets whisked away without redepositing itself onto the rotors. The apex and side seal slots, as well as the heat dams, can be cleaned with small scrapers or the seals themselves (the heat dams aren't that hard to clean with a walnut or dental tool).
12-22-2003, 09:43 PM
#23
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 186
I've since been adding MMO to my oil and fuel tank ever since this thread started. I've noticed an increase in my gas milage and I swear I have a bit more get up when my ports open up. I hope to get the most out of my orignal engine (137,000) before it is time to rebuilt and have the money to do it.
MMO
12-22-2003, 09:45 PM
#24
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 186
Originally Posted by Jeff20B' date='Dec 22 2003, 04:51 PM
It looks like more carbon fell off of the apex seals in the MMO bath. The ATF bath looks the same as it did two days ago.
ATF is so thick compared to MMO. I doubt ATF can get up into the apex seal slots very well. That's one strike against ATF. It also smells kinda bad compared to the relitavely nice smell of MMO. Another strike (sort of). It also resists burning inside automatic trannies. Yet another strike against it. It also fouls spark plugs when MMO doesn't. It also produces solid compounds when burned which clogs cadilac convertors. How many strikes so far?
MMO is great to add to oil and gas, and is thin enough to easily flow up into apex seal slots. It doesn't foul plugs hardly at all (I think). Or it atleast won't foul plugs any worse than pouring oil into the intakes, you know, to unflood an engine or to help start a slow cranking engine. Both of which work fine with no residual plug fouling.
I can't say anything bad about MMO.
I'm going to try to scrape the carbon off the apex seals with a fingernail to feel how difficult it is, now that they've soaked for 48 hours...
ATF is so thick compared to MMO. I doubt ATF can get up into the apex seal slots very well. That's one strike against ATF. It also smells kinda bad compared to the relitavely nice smell of MMO. Another strike (sort of). It also resists burning inside automatic trannies. Yet another strike against it. It also fouls spark plugs when MMO doesn't. It also produces solid compounds when burned which clogs cadilac
MMO is great to add to oil and gas, and is thin enough to easily flow up into apex seal slots. It doesn't foul plugs hardly at all (I think). Or it atleast won't foul plugs any worse than pouring oil into the intakes, you know, to unflood an engine or to help start a slow cranking engine. Both of which work fine with no residual plug fouling.
I can't say anything bad about MMO.
I'm going to try to scrape the carbon off the apex seals with a fingernail to feel how difficult it is, now that they've soaked for 48 hours...
12-22-2003, 10:00 PM
#25
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,284
I made both pie plates dirty from scraping the carbon off the seals. They're still cherry-red, for the most part. I guess I could set up the camera and take a two-color shot (red and cyan). It's an experiement with a black and white CCD camera...
