NoPistons -Mazda Rx7 & Rx8 Rotary Forum

NoPistons -Mazda Rx7 & Rx8 Rotary Forum (https://www.nopistons.com/)
-   Rotary Engine Building, Porting & Swaps (https://www.nopistons.com/rotary-engine-building-porting-swaps-55/)
-   -   Ceramic Coating Rotor Faces (https://www.nopistons.com/rotary-engine-building-porting-swaps-55/ceramic-coating-rotor-faces-71221/)

yallgotboost 12-01-2008 01:38 PM

Has anyone ever used ceramic coating on the rotor faces? At my old job we used Swain TBC™ Ceramic Thermal Barrier* on all are race piston motors. Just wondering if anyone has tried it on a rotary I feel would help keep some of the heat in the combustion rather then soak the rotor. Might also allow a denser air charge to enter the motor with the cooler rotor face. In turn would also keep oil temps down.





*TBC™ Ceramic Thermal Barrier:

For most naturally aspirated and mild boost motors TBC™ is our tried and true ceramic thermal barrier coating. Swain’s TBC™ has come a long way since it started the internal engine coating revolution back in the 1970’s. Now in its 5th generation of development, Swain’s TBC™ uses Swain’s exclusive “Smart Coat” technology which allows the ceramic to expand at the same rate as the piston. TBC™ coated pistons run cooler and retain much more of their tensile strength. TBC™ protects against high temperature oxidation, eliminates hot spots, and encourages proper flame travel. The ceramic also spreads the heat evenly over the entire coated surface reducing detonation, pre-ignition and allowing the use of lower octane fuel. Less heat is conducted through the wrist pins and rods keeping the crank, bearings, oil and entire bottom end cooler.

Nateb123 12-01-2008 05:10 PM


Originally Posted by yallgotboost' post='912742' date='Dec 1 2008, 11:38 AM
Has anyone ever used ceramic coating on the rotor faces? At my old job we used Swain TBC™ Ceramic Thermal Barrier* on all are race piston motors. Just wondering if anyone has tried it on a rotary I feel would help keep some of the heat in the combustion rather then soak the rotor. Might also allow a denser air charge to enter the motor with the cooler rotor face. In turn would also keep oil temps down.



Isn't a warmer rotor face better since it allows for more complete combustion? That would seem to be an issue that is of higher priority due to the abundance of HC shooting out our rotaries' tailpipes. If you're worried about pre-ignition, it shouldn't be too pricey to have your apex seals WPC treated so they don't explode into pieces from a single good knock. Then you get the best of both worlds.

mazdaspeed7 12-01-2008 06:02 PM

Actually, ceramic coatings work by keeping insulating the base material from the combustion heat. About 70% of the energy contained in a given amount of fuel will be lost as heat into the engine, and will have to be disippated by the cooling system. The less heat the engine absorbs from combustion, the more energy available to do mechanical work, i.e. hp.



The problem with the rotary is the combustion chamber has so much surface area for its displacement. Its that much more area for heat to be absorbed, and thats a big part of why rotaries use more fuel to make a given hp number that modern piston engines. In theory, its an ideal application for coatings. In reality, only a handful of people have run them, and Ive yet to see any conclusive results. Some coatings are not up to the conditions inside a rotary engine, and can flake off. But that may not be an issue anymore, with the continual advancements.



And FYI, oem apex seals have decades of engineering behind them ensuring that they offer the best balance of compromises for the engine. Bad tuning is what kills apex seals, not the seal material. You can break anything and everything with bad tuning.

yallgotboost 12-01-2008 07:41 PM

I've had real good luck with swain coatings in the past no flaking on any of the piston motors. I've seen pistons that had a lean nitrous melt down still have coating on the pistons where the piston wasn’t burned threw. Think I may give it a shot on my next motor.

Nateb123 12-01-2008 09:26 PM


Originally Posted by yallgotboost' post='912761' date='Dec 1 2008, 05:41 PM
I've had real good luck with swain coatings in the past no flaking on any of the piston motors. I've seen pistons that had a lean nitrous melt down still have coating on the pistons where the piston wasn't burned threw. Think I may give it a shot on my next motor.



Sounds like quality stuff! Might try it when I need to rebuild next time. And thanks for the info MS7.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:33 AM.


© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands