I dont see the big deal in it?

Its not like they are spying on you talking to your Aunt Sally, if they are listening in on your

conversations that means you have done something wrong to warrant it.



Obviously they feel there are informants and the need to get things done right away before waiting for warrants.

i agree.



it's saved out ass us in the past.



people bitch now, but they'll be bitching more when another building gets taken out. and another 3,000+ people die.

It doesnt matter what the guy does he is wrong, I would hate to be the president



good thing I have a few incidents on my permenent record that keeps me from becoming president.

Nope. Can't do it. There's no way to keep it from being abused. Don't let fear make you willing to give up your liberty.



Government will seek to enslave you one step at a time. This is one of those steps.



Discuss.

be serious- do you think they are listening in to get your secret recipes?

anyone know how they do it? have any articles? are calls routed through computers that scan conversations for key words? then if a key word is spotted, the conversation is tagged and recorded?



im curious how they do this.

they record the length of time your Hobbs meter was energized. If you rent the plane for 7 hours and only record 1 hour on the hobbs meter they know you have circumvented the elaborate plot to extend the NYC commute time and the only people who want to get to NYC quickly are those intent on causing it harm. REALLY, my pilot friends have told me so!

Actually, it's true.. whether or not it's being abused now, there's no check or balance. I tend to believe in unconditional freedom. With that, I want my safety, so I don't oppose unwarranted wiretaps, I just wish there was a way to review and monitor the government's use.

wiretap the wiretaps?

they've been wiretapping for years.



i say let em' keep doing it if it'll save lives.

actually they are allowed to tap ANYONE's line in a time of war for 15 days, then they go ask for the warrant, which in a time of war is given immediatly.



If they felt it was needed to not inform the court then maybe thay have reason not to trust them.



What a tangled web we weave when we first practice to decieve

Phone sex. Discuss.

yeah if they tapped mine they would be bored, or confused depending

I'm against this. I might just be a closeminded twat, or an openminded twat. I agree that it could possibly save lives, but where do you draw the line? When is enough surveillance enough? I'm furthermore enraged that Bush, in all his redneck splendor, sees himself above the law and justified in circumventing/breaking it.

Well the bottom line is all the bitchin and screaming are from these same mofo's who would be yelling if "their" standerd of surveilence was used and then a raghead blows up some childrens hospital, mall or airport.

What ?now then Bushes fault because he doesnt use better intelligence?Damn him. No way does the pre act surveilence design protect us the same. By no reasonable explanation could it except for those who are just bitchin due to politics.

my stinky opinion.

Yeah like a DUI, or narcotics charge. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...1047683664.gif https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...1047683894.gif https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...1047683473.gif

you guys dont understand- in a time of war they are allowed to wiretap, THEN they have to get permission to do it for more then 15 days or whatever the number of days are.



I guess you think its wrong that they were sniffing for radioactive materials around the muslim mosques and hangouts as well?



The laws need to re-written because todays technology moves much faster then the lawmakers do.

so the whole problem people have with this is it violates your freedom yet no one ever adresses the fact if you are not doing anything wrong you have nothing to worry about. I say go ahead and tap a away just regulate what is done with the info. If you do not like the wire taps I hear cuba is in need of a few citizens and you can probally find someonewho will trade with you in china and you can tell that goverment they are no being fair. Mainly my point is the system is flawed but it is still the best system we have and others hate us for that and if a wire tap will help those fuckers die than I could care less if you tap every phone in america and atleast they are telling you they are doing it.

good points, maybe the evidence wont hold up in a court of law because of our system, but if it saves lives and prevents terrorist attacks then Im all for it.

My, my. What a thumping good read! Lions eatting Christians, people nailing each other to two-by-fours. I say, you won't find that in Winnie the Pooh.

For once, steve replies with a witicism

you have a point... i was asking a lot of people at work whether or not they were for/against wiretap.. it was actually evenly divided, but both sides felt strongly about being for/against it.



however, i agree with l8t apex that the people who are against it, are the people that are gonna be bitchin' when something goes down. why not use wiretaps as aids against terrorists?



i would hate being president. can't do anything right. (but i bet you could get good head in the oval office)

so his ass CAN type!

I probably speak for myself BUT:



I'm more than happy to give up many freedoms if it keeps people safe and assholes dead or in prison. I for one have no problem with Uncle Sam stepping on the toes of a few for the greater good of the many. If my toe happens to get stepped on, so be it. I for one am sick of giving up each and every freedom Americans have, in the military, just to hear people bitching about the most trivial of things. I doubt if the government really gives a **** that Lance is ******* Lucy's daughter. If people have nothing to hide, why the outrage of wire-taps?

well put



people need to sacrifice some things for thier freedoms now and then.



Lets see someone lose a loved one to a terrorist attack and keep the same views.

Well, if today its wiretaps, then tomorrow it could be checking your bank statements to see where you're spending your money. Think about this-who the **** knows who's actually being wiretapped? It could be only what they say, or it could be corporate interest based; I imagine with the power of this wiretapping, a potential political opponent could be made to look pretty bad, and there are no checks/balances in it. Then the next day the government could be making sure you haven't deviated from your preprogramed routine based off what a microchip imbedded in the back of your hand says you should be doing at this exact point in time, so you must be a terrorist...



This is a lot like **** sex. Put the dick in a little at a time, and people grumble, but dont freak out. They expect to be fucked a bit by the government. Keep inching in, and before you know it the entire country has a huge Orwellian **** up their ass. Yes, it can happen to you.



A war on terror isnt like a war against a country. We're not fighting citizens of a nation, we're fighting ideals and fanaticism. Do you really think they can actually figure out who opposes them unless eventually we're all mindless, taxpaying cattle? Then, whoever opposes this system is given the broadly defined label of "terrorist" then you're whisked away to sunny Guantanamo Bay.



I'm also fine with the radiation sweeps of the mosques, etc. That's one thing. Radation is detectable from spyplanes, etc. Flying 6 miles above my apartment and sweeping the area looking for isotopes doesnt have the same intrusion factor as listening to your calls. In fact, comparing the two are like comparing apples and oranges.



I appreciate the sacrifices our soldiers make, too. Having a Vietnam War vet for a Dad really helped ingrain a deep sense of reverence for them. In fact, I tried to get in the service myself but couldnt because I'm a huge fatass. Now, with the appreciation I have for our men and women at arms, does it make me such a huge cockanus to say I oppose the war in Iraq and what I perceive as the senseless deaths of our troops? Now, don't lump me in with that ******* Martian Michael Crook. That guy is a ******* traitor. All I'm saying is, can't we dedicate some of our efforts into finding another way?



I think that if we keep waiving our rights for the greater good, then eventually, the America we're fighting for will be gone, and for what? For an extra ounce of this illusion called security? **** that. Call me a visionary, call me a pinko commie bastard, but you can't kill an idea without killing everyone who might someday harbor this idea (example: die american infidel pigdogs) or brainwashing the masses into believing the way you do.



I dont expect any of you to agree with me.







/tangent

I do agree with you an extent. And I can see your concern, although I doubt the things you are worried about will come to be. I put my trust in the government and our leaders everday. Although they arent always right, I believe they do have Americas best interest at heart. Sure they play their little games, but when push comes to shove its about Americas safety.

josh acts like no one ever listens in to phone convos, like its a new thing



its just the news event of the week, next week everyone will forget all about it and they will keep on listening.



If there were listening to EVERYTHING the FBI would have banged on your door a long time ago in concern to all the Red Bull.

And they kind of do check into bank transactions- anything over $10000 has to be reported to the government.

Taken to its logical conclusion, one day the penis of government will be planted firmly up your butt and while you will be walking a little funny, you'll say how it's all in the best interests of America.

I stay safe by wearing a TINFOIL hat when I am thinking, that way the men in the Big BLACK Helicopter can't hear what I am thinking

that would probably work in the fantasy land some people live in

cell-phone land?

naaaaaa, a mall!





seriously though- its for the people who think the government, both federal and local, always get warrants BEFORE they listen in on phone conversations

they know about this conversation.

and the other conversation about that guy who has that problem with that thing