i have been reading what everyone was telling "blight" about 300hp with his turbo.......... now, what can you all tell me about N/A's??? i want that kind of power without the turbo for now (300rwhp)! i can't figure out my problem with my motor and it is just getting worse, so i am going to pull the motor and tear it down! i will fix it peice by peice if i have to! i plan on doing the porting myself also! i know how to port heads and so on with a piston motor, so this can't be that much more difficult! i have been reading up alot about porting these motors and i know where to get the templates from! eventually i will convert it to a big ass turbo, but for now i am going to keep it easy!

If you want 300rwhp, you are better off getting an already modded turbo II, or converting the N/A to a TII. Not saying you CAN'T turbo a six port block, just saying it's more difficult and complex than BUYING an already modded TII.

true, but its still a lot of fun.

you say it is alot of fun....... which tells me you have or know someone that has done it! what do i need to do to the N/A to get that power out of it??? i have seen that they make turbo conversion kits for my motor, granted it is alot of work and fun, not to mention alot of beer, but it can be done! i know that it would be hard because of the compression of my motor, but i am willy to try it! first i want to punch some power with no turbo and then when i get used to that much power with that little car..... then i will put the turbo on it and really have some fun! give me some ideas if you can please! i know about porting and fuel to air and so on, but is there anything more special about these cars??? thanks!

PP or nitrous will be the only way get that power. Have fun!

It has nothing to with the compression. A tuner (good one) can overcome the compression numbers of the N/A blocks. It's the six port design. The 5th and 6th ports activate at a certain rpm. When you are that rpm, that's usually when a turbo is right in the middle of spooling. So you have 5th and 6th ports activating, and you have a turbo spooling forcing MORE air into the motor.



I don't know who has done this conversion on this forum, but there are some on the other forums who have done it and have a good running car, but they would have been better of with a TII or a complete swap out.



And yeah, the only way to achieve anywhere close to 300rwhp would be a periphreal ported engine, or some N20. But you step into those boundaries, especially the p-ported engine, you are running into BIG bucks. Unless you do it yourself.



Good luck.

also it will probly be unstreetable with those ports and turboing an n/a will probly cost alot more than a tII swap but i could be wrong if certain things are applied

Most p-ports are unstreetable. I think mike(j9) was saying that his will be more streetable than a bridgeport.

I street drive my p-port pretty regularly, yeah its loud, and back pressure totally kills power on a p-port..

They make quite a bit of low end power, way more than a stock n/a. They like to be throttle loaded, so you have to change your driving style a bit. Mine makes a peak right now or 206 rwhp as measure on a mustang dyno in street trim. In my light base fc it makes for a fun ride. right at around 4000, it starts to pull harder than my TII did when it was a BPU s4 turbo car and it screams all the way to 9500 easily...

The cool part is with the turbo transmission I pass 60 miles an hour at the top end of 2nd and its lag free so it makes for some pretty outrageous zero-sixty times if those float your boat. You have to drive it like you stole it to truly enjoy it, and kiss listening to the stereo goodbye as well..... https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...O_DIR#>/v2.gif

Maxt, what does your's idle at though? That's the biggest thing that turns people off about them. Never heard a p-port at idle though. Heard plenty of b-ports though.

im in the middle of something. Im pretty much adapting all the stock turbo parts to my NA block. intake manifolds, electronics, the works. its been a fun project so far, i just need to finish it! i still need a fuel pump, boost gauge, and a wideband for safety, but i think i wont have spent more then 1-1500 on the whole thing once im done.

Most of the time its up in the 1100-1300 range, depending on temperature, it idles as low as 500 when its really cold outside. When its warmed up the idle will creep a bit because the throttlebodies I am using wont close enough to lower the idle speed further, if the throttlebodies would allow it, I would set it at 900.

Oh, that ain't to bad. Got any vid or sound clip of it idling/running?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYPyDSZ6Uo0

I just uploaded one, of the initial startup, it was running on a 4x1600cc map, still not bad for the first couple of minutes of run time.. Next time I go grocery shopping I will shoot a tuned idle vid..

It might take a few minutes for youtube to approve the video.

omg sounds so delisious

not bad, even with the tune off like that, it still wants to run ok

i put the full stock TII set up on my NA. only cost me about $500 or so. but you'll need a stand alone ECU or your motor will be short lived. oh, and of course fuel upgrades. and there was no more 6 ports on the manifold cause i used the TII intake manifolds. even if you use the NA ones, you can easily take the 6 port acuators off. i did this even while it still was NA.

yeah turboing the 6port NA block isnt that hard, ive done it



pretty much to do it, you need everything for a turbo swap minus the motor, thats the turbo, the intake manifolds, ecu, injectors, afm, boost sensor, ect.... then you just port match the 4 port intake to the 6 port block, and then of course custom oil and coolent lines...



If you dont have all those parts laying around its probbaly a better idea to buy a real t2 engine with all the goods on it.



( however it works great when your in a situation like me where u have all the turbo parts but no turbo blocks!! haha )



i would aslo not recomend doing this to a high milage motor as it wont last very long if its allready worn out.

So what do you guys do for tuning? As most know, the compression of the N/A rotors is higher than the Turbo's. So how do you overcome it? Or is it just not that much of a big deal?

i believe they run lower boost with a standalone to monitor wats goin on

So there would be no point really to do a NA->TII swap if you can't use the entire turbo system to it's full advantage. Unless you got it tuned professionally that is, than it would be worth it.

yes but u also have to figure the high compression makes up for some of the boost lost

Makes sense to me. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.gif

well on my 6 port turbo setup, i have the rtek 1.7 ecu w 720cc secondarys , and then i was using a SAFC( again which i had laying around) to add some extra fuel just to be on the safe side.



i dynoed 231hp at 10 psi on a 6 port motor with about 200K miles on it ( haha yeah a time bomb waiting to go off!!, but i wanted to try something different and it actually lasted about 6 months of hard abuse, gave me enough boost fix till i could start building a real street ported t2 motor. This is why i caution against turboing a worn out motor as they wont last if its about to go allready)





in comparison i dynoed 133 hp NA with ehxuast on the dyno. allmost a 100 hp increase, i was more then happy, torque increased about the same as well

wow congratulations

wow! that's not bad at all! i might have to do one of these sometime. but only with a n/a with a LSD

i like these numbers. i have 720 secondaries and a SAFC2 also, but no rtek. but fuel wise that just tweaks the maps so you dont have to tune out as much fuel when the 720s kick on, right? and did you retard the timing any yourself or use stock NA settings?

i found on my t2 that around 8psi, with 550/680's that it was just about right. or 10% more hp + 10% more fuel worked out rather nicely.



id start with the timing retarded a little, and see what it likes, have a feeling its going to want to be close to stock...

i wouldnt imagine that NA and TII engines run the same timing stock? and since were boosting NA blocks, i would think retarding the timing a little would be a good idea?

well on the issue of timing, the rtek ecu is designed for a boosted motor and has timing maps for running boost.... most people say the stock timing maps are fairly conservitive anyway.....



so i think timing is allright on the motor, this would be why i added some extra fuel to keep temperatures in there down a bit



i supose it wouldnt hurt to turn the cas back a couple deg or so, but then your timings gonna be a lil off all the time...

damn guys that's alot of info to take in! lol! thanks! so it doesn't seem like it is going to be that hard to get the power increase! if i could double my power or close to it then that would be great for now! i am still going to do the turbo mod. eventually! i drive my car like it is a race car and that everywhere i drive is a race track! i am pretty good at that! could i put a ported or bigger intake on it to get more power like on a piston motor??? hell, is there any books on this **** that i could get that would give me step by step procedures??? that's it for now! thanks everyone!

true. it retards the timing what, 1 degree per psi over 9psi? Im using a turbo ecu/afm/boost sensor. so that should adjust the timing accordingly.

https://www.nopistons.com/forums/ind...showtopic=3426



Go there, it's all in stages. Good writeup. There are many more writeups in the FAQ section you need to take a look at as you seem to be a new RX-7 owner.



Good Luck.

oh well then yeah you're good

Timing on the stock ecu retards timing about 1 deg per psi on any positive pressure( but stoped at about 9 since its programed to cut fuel anyway), the rtek just continues this timing retard up until the boost sensor maxes out which is about 1 bar