Well, the altenator, plugs and plug wires are new, the starter is fine.



its like my engine isnt catching at first, i have to listen carefully for it to catch, when it does, i have to give it gas to keep it from dying.....



this is all on a gsl-se



any idea what it could be?

ok guys heres what its doing, basically what matt said but with more detail. it turns over quickly but doesnt start up right away, and when it does its really weak and you have to give it gas so it wont die. last night he tried to start it 3 or 4 times and it sounded like it was about to start but it didnt catch and sounded like it was out of gas really.



matt im pretty sure those plug wires you got are 6.5 mm, and didnt have a brand name on them. do you still have the box or know what brand they are? it sounds like maybe its not getting a good spark.



also, lately your car has been sounding a little weak when its running. it idles great (at the right spot) but just doesnt sound strong.



p.s. was your car smoking at all? i think you said it was last night when you started it.





matt when do you work today? bring your car up here to the cu and let me look at it

[quote name='Shane.Trammell' date='May 14 2005, 05:53 AM']ok guys heres what its doing, basically what matt said but with more detail. it turns over quickly but doesnt start up right away, and when it does its really weak and you have to give it gas so it wont die.



matt im pretty sure those plug wires you got are 6.5 mm, and didnt have a brand name on them. do you still have the box or know what brand they are? it sounds like maybe its not getting a good spark.



also, lately your car has been sounding a little weak when its running. it idles great (at the right spot) but just doesnt sound strong.



p.s. was your car smoking at all? i think you said it was last night when you started it.


[/quote]



pug wires are from standard plus.



car runs stronger then it ever has when its running, its just the starting problem.



last night, for the first time, it smoked on startup.



when we were out of the theatre last night, it took 3 times to crank, on the third time, i put off a nice cloud of smoke, smelled like it had gas in it too. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub..._DIR#>/sad.png



the plugs are ngk iradium's, i may have the box around here somewhere, but you did see how they werent seated terribly well, i dont know what the deal with that is.



- matt

im running stock s5 plugs and they stick out a little also.

how old are the plugs ? Wires wouldn't play a role in this situation I don't think, especially becaues the car runs well after startup. My 1st gen usually started up very quickly, but after the plugs got old and gas soaked a few times, the fast turnover of the motor started to perish. Just try new plugs if you haven't already.

the plugs were replaced less than a month ago at the same time as the wires. the car doesnt really run fine after startup, at least it doesnt sound like it does. the car used to sound strong and had a nice note with the full rb, but now it sounds kind of light and airy, or just weak. also, i think when its idling and you rev it it hesitates for a second before revving.



would it make a difference if the plugs were highway, or "hot" plugs?

Yup I'm gonna say it even though you don't want to hear it...



Have you done a compression test. It souds like apex seals might be sticking or it may have some damaged seals.

[quote name='ArmyOfOne' date='May 14 2005, 08:41 AM']Yup I'm gonna say it even though you don't want to hear it...



Have you done a compression test. It souds like apex seals might be sticking or it may have some damaged seals.


[/quote]



which symptoms would suggest that? ill do the ghetto comp test on it a little later today, and maybe try the atf trick in case the seals are sticking.

[quote name='ArmyOfOne' date='May 14 2005, 10:41 AM']Yup I'm gonna say it even though you don't want to hear it...



Have you done a compression test. It souds like apex seals might be sticking or it may have some damaged seals.


[/quote]





meh, i would say so as well, but if the motor runs great and has a good Idle after it gets started, i would highly doubt a apex seal problem honestly. If it was a apex prob, it would run decent when driving, but wouldn't idle worth a dime and the motor would shake pretty violently.



I'd say check the carb/injectors if its EFI for leak, sounds like your just Mini-flooding the motor.

[quote name='nopistons94' date='May 14 2005, 08:44 AM']it would run decent when driving, but wouldn't idle worth a dime and the motor would shake pretty violently.

[/quote]



it does shake a bit



when he tries to start it it does have the sound of a flooded motor. then with the white puff at start up and the heavy fuel smell it could be leaky injectors.

I have seen engines that gave the same symptoms as this and the compression test showed some problems.



At speed centrifugal force keeps seals planted to the wall a bit better. If compression is good then check the injectors. It is less of a pain to check compression than to check injectors IMO.

[quote name='ArmyOfOne' date='May 14 2005, 11:04 AM']I have seen engines that gave the same symptoms as this and the compression test showed some problems.



At speed centrifugal force keeps seals planted to the wall a bit better. If compression is good then check the injectors. It is less of a pain to check compression than to check injectors IMO.


[/quote]







I know what your saying, but i just don't agree on using the blown motor statement for everything. If its a fuel smoke and hard starting, i would say leaky injector bottom line. But your right, check compression first because its easier just to clear that out. But i would say fuel issue.



A little shaking on any motor is normal, im talking violently or out of the normal.

matt says he ordered a dist. cap from the parts store bc i mentioned that that could be the problem last night, causing a weak spark





also could this be caused by a bad fuel filter?

I doubt it, a clogged fuel filter would result in a weaker fuel flow in most cases. I'd say not enough spark to get the motor going at first, or just a leaky injector that when it sits, fuel gets dripped into the motor resulting in fouling the plugs a little bit causing hard starting. You can try the new dizzy first though, could always use a new one anyway

[quote name='nopistons94' date='May 14 2005, 10:39 AM']I doubt it, a clogged fuel filter would result in a weaker fuel flow in most cases. I'd say not enough spark to get the motor going at first, or just a leaky injector that when it sits, fuel gets dripped into the motor resulting in fouling the plugs a little bit causing hard starting. You can try the new dizzy first though, could always use a new one anyway


[/quote]



havent changed the fuel filter since ive had the car, ive put maybe 15k miles on it...



but i dont know how old it is, it was on the car when i bought it, i just need to put the new fuel filter on, do a compression check and all that.



holds idle beautifully, runs better and stronger then ever, engine has just a slight shake when i rev her hard but nothing noticible during driving, you cant feel it when it runs, but you can see it with the hood popped and revving hard.



im thinking it may be the injectors.



a small puff of smoke and it smells like gas, im hoping for the best and expecting the worst https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...closedeyes.gif

your motor mounts might be aging man, but im talking about at idle, the motor shaking violently. My motor moves a little to, nothing to worry about really. I'd say its the injectors i bet they are still stock and never have been touched. Prob dripping like crazy

checked the compressrion with trammell tonight, all is well, its the injectors.

[quote name='fcrotornut' date='May 14 2005, 11:53 PM']checked the compressrion with trammell tonight, all is well, its the injectors.


[/quote]





so what was the compression for shits and giggles?

glad to hear, thats why I don't always rush right into blown motor

[quote name='nopistons94' date='May 15 2005, 01:39 AM']glad to hear, thats why I don't always rush right into blown motor


[/quote]





Yah people are quick to say bad motor, N/A rotaries are pretty tuff, 12A rotaries are just about bulletproof! Throw a turbo and a bad tune on a rotary and its toast but thats the same for any motor.

[quote name='1revnrex' date='May 14 2005, 10:12 PM']Yah people are quick to say bad motor, N/A rotaries are pretty tuff, 12A rotaries are just about bulletproof! Throw a turbo and a bad tune on a rotary and its toast but thats the same for any motor.


[/quote]



i dont drive mine that hard, unless im hanging with trammell of course, but you know, 2 se's cruising around arent going to be moving too slow.



it seems like alot of people like to jump to a blown seal for an answer to any major problems.

its blown!!!!



wait oooooooh



jk

hah, my 12a saw 9k rpms about 10 times and never had any issues ever. I also premixed heavily as well(4 oz per fill), which made my motor run 1000X better than before i started premixing. If i were you guys, I'd start premixing, you WILL see a improvement in idle, as well as just all around driving. try it !

[quote name='nopistons94' date='May 15 2005, 10:00 AM']hah, my 12a saw 9k rpms about 10 times and never had any issues ever. I also premixed heavily as well(4 oz per fill), which made my motor run 1000X better than before i started premixing. If i were you guys, I'd start premixing, you WILL see a improvement in idle, as well as just all around driving. try it !


[/quote]



i dont know if us SE guys need to premix,i still have an OMP

[quote name='fcrotornut' date='May 15 2005, 07:23 PM']i dont know if us SE guys need to premix,i still have an OMP


[/quote]





So do I, it helps bump your compression a bit, every little bit helps on a high mileage motor. Also if your omp were to become clogged or you were to crack a meter line from the pump itself you wouldnt eat a rotor up because you would be all pre-mixed and what not. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png

[quote name='1revnrex' date='May 14 2005, 09:58 PM']so what was the compression for shits and giggles?


[/quote]



we did the ghetto unofficial (open spark plug)comp test, but it works well enough for us!

Are you starting the car properly?



Before you crank, floor the pedal and release it. This sets the fast idle cam, and makes the car start easier.

[quote name='Feds' date='May 16 2005, 01:25 PM']Are you starting the car properly?



Before you crank, floor the pedal and release it. This sets the fast idle cam, and makes the car start easier.


[/quote]



youre saying thats the "proper" way to start it? where is the fast idle cam located and would the tb being rather dirty and sticking have anything to do with this?

today i realized, since ive had the car, my 5th and 6th ports havent opened.



no cat.



i thought the car was feeling pretty dang quick, i can onyl imagine when i get the ports to open.



im thinking about wiring them open.

[quote name='Shane.Trammell' date='May 16 2005, 03:37 PM']youre saying thats the "proper" way to start it? where is the fast idle cam located and would the tb being rather dirty and sticking have anything to do with this?


[/quote]



Fast idle cam is in the throttle body. That's why there is a coolant line that goes there.



A dirty/sticky TB is never a good thing, but in this case, it doesn't sound likely.

another post on matts behalf:



the other day he complains about a clicking noise when the car is running. i take a look and the clicking is pretty loud, comes from the engine bay, speeds up with revving, and clicks at the same time the pulsation damper pulses.



bad pd? could this be the problem?



anyone know where to get cheap injectors? mtrix has em for like 338 each!

[quote name='Shane.Trammell' date='May 18 2005, 02:05 PM']another post on matts behalf:



the other day he complains about a clicking noise when the car is running. i take a look and the clicking is pretty loud, comes from the engine bay, speeds up with revving, and clicks at the same time the pulsation damper pulses.



bad pd? could this be the problem?



anyone know where to get cheap injectors? mtrix has em for like 338 each!


[/quote]



skip ink's getting them for me 325 for a pair.

cool but what the heck is skip inks? also, i think we still need to try my wires on there before you go spending $300 on something you may not need.



also, does anyone have an opinion on whether or not the loud clicking from the pd could have something to do with possible injector leaking?

[quote name='Shane.Trammell' date='May 19 2005, 01:36 PM']cool but what the heck is skip inks? also, i think we still need to try my wires on there before you go spending $300 on something you may not need.



also, does anyone have an opinion on whether or not the loud clicking from the pd could have something to do with possible injector leaking?


[/quote]





Try this one, do a full tuneup on it, plugs,wires,cap and rotor, oil change filter the whole nine. Then take it from there.

[quote name='1revnrex' date='May 19 2005, 11:44 AM']Try this one, do a full tuneup on it, plugs,wires,cap and rotor, oil change filter the whole nine. Then take it from there.


[/quote]



just did a near full tuneup, with the exception of rotor and cap.



ill try and swap plug wires with trammell soon.



see if that helps.



but noen of that would explain the whole, gassy smelling smoke from exhaust would it?

matt you shoot so many flames that your car has to be running rich, maybe if we tune it again the prob will go away

https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/smile.png [quote name='1revnrex' date='May 15 2005, 08:44 PM']So do I, it helps bump your compression a bit, every little bit helps on a high mileage motor. Also if your omp were to become clogged or you were to crack a meter line from the pump itself you wouldnt eat a rotor up because you would be all pre-mixed and what not. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png


[/quote]

https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/smile.png I had the same problem on my GSLSE and it was the fuel pump next time it does not start hit the fuel pump